I received Richard Anderson's book just a bit ago on the three and eight witnesses.
Are testimonies, such as the following, those in which DCP argues we should have confidence? This was from some random page I opened up:
In later life David relived the journey, picturing himself and Oliver on the spring seat of the wagon, with Joseph behind on the board bed. The earliest journal account relates David's story as follows: "And an aged man about 5 feet 10, heavy set and on his back an old fashioned army knapsack strapped over his shoulders and something square in it, and he walked alongside of the wagon and wiped the sweat off his face, smiling very pleasant. David asked him to ride and he replied, 'I am going across to the Hill Cumorah.' Soon after they passed, they felt strange and stopped but could see nothing of him—all around was clear. And they asked the Lord about it. He said that the Prophet looked as white as a sheet and said that it was one of the Nephites, and that he had the plates " 30 In another interview David portrayed the messenger carrying the plates, "about 5 feet 8 or 9 inches tall and heavy set," with "large" face, "a suit of brown woolen clothes, his hair and beard . . . white."
Well,...
I detest my loose style and my libertine sentiments. I thank God, who has removed from my eyes the veil... Adrian Beverland
gramps wrote:I received Richard Anderson's book just a bit ago on the three and eight witnesses.
Are testimonies, such as the following, those in which DCP argues we should have confidence? This was from some random page I opened up:
In later life David relived the journey, picturing himself and Oliver on the spring seat of the wagon, with Joseph behind on the board bed. The earliest journal account relates David's story as follows: "And an aged man about 5 feet 10, heavy set and on his back an old fashioned army knapsack strapped over his shoulders and something square in it, and he walked alongside of the wagon and wiped the sweat off his face, smiling very pleasant. David asked him to ride and he replied, 'I am going across to the Hill Cumorah.' Soon after they passed, they felt strange and stopped but could see nothing of him—all around was clear. And they asked the Lord about it. He said that the Prophet looked as white as a sheet and said that it was one of the Nephites, and that he had the plates " 30 In another interview David portrayed the messenger carrying the plates, "about 5 feet 8 or 9 inches tall and heavy set," with "large" face, "a suit of brown woolen clothes, his hair and beard . . . white."
Well,...
Apparently, that Nephite angel had nothing against equality of the sexes, as well:
After the translators had moved into the Whitmer home, Mother Whitmer told David a remarkable episode of the same messenger. "My mother was going to milk the cows, when she was met out near the yard by the same old man (judging by her description of him) who said to her: 'You have been very faithful and diligent in your labors, but you are tried because of the increase of your toil; it is proper therefore that you should receive a witness that your faith may be strengthened.' Thereupon he showed her the plates."
I detest my loose style and my libertine sentiments. I thank God, who has removed from my eyes the veil... Adrian Beverland
Daniel Peterson You're making things up. Nobody said that she "ran around" with anything. They lived in a tiny little house. All she had to do was to move a few feet with the object.
Nor did the object necessarily weigh sixty-five pounds. A common estimate among the witnesses is sixty pounds, and some put it as low as forty.
I didn’t say she was running just that she was strong enough to carry 65 pounds. Whitmer by the way said it was Joseph Smith's mother.. who carried the plates. Strong family – but wait! Maybe its only 40lbs. .. .Yea that’s the ticket!
Do you notice how you have to change the facts to comport with holes in the story?
Edit to add:
DCP Dogmatic certainty from nearly two centuries after the event Trump's collective and independent eyewitness testimony, repeated over decades, of people who actually saw, touched, and held the object.
Can you provide any proof the relic in this story is the same relic shown the Whitmer family et.al. later?
Last edited by Maureen on Fri Oct 03, 2008 9:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.
God has the right to create and to destroy, to make like and to kill. He can delegate this authority if he wishes to. I know that can be scary. Deal with it. Nehor.. Nov 08, 2010
I can't keep track and remember Mormon stories about various events, there are so many variations.
Other than J. Smith who claimed to have seen golden plates with normal eyes/eyesight (not spiritual, not atypical) with nothing covering up/hiding the plates?