Speaking of Paul H. Dunn...

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_Buffalo
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Re: Speaking of Paul H. Dunn...

Post by _Buffalo »

Morley wrote:
why me wrote:
Give me a break. People lie. People make mistakes. People are fraudsters. And people are swindlers. People are also killers. People steal. People cheat. No one is honest if they are honest with who they are. Are you perfect? I don't think so. And if you are not perfect, why should have Dunn been perfect.


No one here is wishing that Dunn had been perfect. They're wishing that Dunn was adequate.


SWK taught that we should literally be perfect.
Parley P. Pratt wrote:We must lie to support brother Joseph, it is our duty to do so.

B.R. McConkie, © Intellectual Reserve wrote:There are those who say that revealed religion and organic evolution can be harmonized. This is both false and devilish.
_just me
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Re: Speaking of Paul H. Dunn...

Post by _just me »

2 Nephi 9:34 Wo unto the liar, for he shall be thrust down to hell.


JUST KIDDING!

God totally doesn't care if people lie. He just cares if you touch your penis.
~Those who benefit from the status quo always attribute inequities to the choices of the underdog.~Ann Crittenden
~The Goddess is not separate from the world-She is the world and all things in it.~
_Buffalo
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Re: Speaking of Paul H. Dunn...

Post by _Buffalo »

just me wrote:
2 Nephi 9:34 Wo unto the liar, for he shall be thrust down to hell.


JUST KIDDING!

God totally doesn't care if people lie. He just cares if you touch your penis.


I lol'd at at that!
Parley P. Pratt wrote:We must lie to support brother Joseph, it is our duty to do so.

B.R. McConkie, © Intellectual Reserve wrote:There are those who say that revealed religion and organic evolution can be harmonized. This is both false and devilish.
_consiglieri
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Re: Speaking of Paul H. Dunn...

Post by _consiglieri »

why me wrote:Give me a break. People lie. People make mistakes. People are fraudsters. And people are swindlers. People are also killers. People steal. People cheat. No one is honest if they are honest with who they are. Are you perfect? I don't think so. And if you are not perfect, why should have Dunn been perfect.


I can't understand why you seem to be going to such lengths to legitimize the whoppers told by a general authority of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.

I find it reprehensible.

Is your only reason for backing Elder Dunn because he was a human?

Or because he was a Mormon human?

Or because he is now a dead Mormon human?



I'm honestly not getting it, Why Me.

All the Best!

--Consiglieri
You prove yourself of the devil and anti-mormon every word you utter, because only the devil perverts facts to make their case.--ldsfaqs (6-24-13)
_moksha
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Re: Speaking of Paul H. Dunn...

Post by _moksha »

bcspace wrote:Or as sure as Lynn Packer wasn't a reporter for the Arizona Republic.


Think he was speaking of Lynn Packer (nephew of you know who) and former BYU Professor. He was latter and award winning investigative reporter for the Salt Lake City Weekly.
Cry Heaven and let loose the Penguins of Peace
_why me
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Re: Speaking of Paul H. Dunn...

Post by _why me »

consiglieri wrote:
why me wrote:Give me a break. People lie. People make mistakes. People are fraudsters. And people are swindlers. People are also killers. People steal. People cheat. No one is honest if they are honest with who they are. Are you perfect? I don't think so. And if you are not perfect, why should have Dunn been perfect.


I can't understand why you seem to be going to such lengths to legitimize the whoppers told by a general authority of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.

I find it reprehensible.

Is your only reason for backing Elder Dunn because he was a human?

Or because he was a Mormon human?

Or because he is now a dead Mormon human?



I'm honestly not getting it, Why Me.

All the Best!

--Consiglieri


It is the tone of the thread that gets me. The Dunn episode makes its appearance every two years or so on this board. The critics bring it up again and again to score points. I believe that we should let a dead horse rest in peace. Now if people wish to discuss this event with a humane tone, I would see no problem with this. But to score points against an entire church is wrong.

Dunn made a mistake. He was a human being just like anyone else and he made a mistake. I have no idea what was in his heart. I have no idea why he did what he did. But at the end of the day, it really doesn't matter. I don't expect perfection from anyone and that includes general authorities.

The bigger question is: why are you so condemning...showing no forgiveness?
I intend to lay a foundation that will revolutionize the whole world.
Joseph Smith


We are “to feed the hungry, to clothe the naked, to provide for the widow, to dry up the tear of the orphan, to comfort the afflicted, whether in this church, or in any other, or in no church at all…”
Joseph Smith
_MsJack
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Re: Speaking of Paul H. Dunn...

Post by _MsJack »

why me wrote:The bigger question is: why are you so condemning...showing no forgiveness?

The same way you've forgiven 19th-century Protestants who harassed Mormons or turned a blind eye to their hardships by not bringing them up and using them to attack modern-day Protestants every chance you get?

Oh, wait . . .

why me wrote:I don't expect perfection from anyone and that includes general authorities.

Too bad it doesn't include your Protestant neighbors.
"It seems to me that these women were the head (κεφάλαιον) of the church which was at Philippi." ~ John Chrysostom, Homilies on Philippians 13

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_why me
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Re: Speaking of Paul H. Dunn...

Post by _why me »

Buffalo wrote:
No, but they say we should follow the prophet without question. So, it really adds up to the same thing.


Who are they? I have never heard such a thing.
I intend to lay a foundation that will revolutionize the whole world.
Joseph Smith


We are “to feed the hungry, to clothe the naked, to provide for the widow, to dry up the tear of the orphan, to comfort the afflicted, whether in this church, or in any other, or in no church at all…”
Joseph Smith
_beefcalf
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Re: Speaking of Paul H. Dunn...

Post by _beefcalf »

why me wrote:It is the tone of the thread that gets me. The Dunn episode makes its appearance every two years or so on this board. The critics bring it up again and again to score points. I believe that we should let a dead horse rest in peace. Now if people wish to discuss this event with a humane tone, I would see no problem with this. But to score points against an entire church is wrong.

Dunn made a mistake. He was a human being just like anyone else and he made a mistake. I have no idea what was in his heart. I have no idea why he did what he did. But at the end of the day, it really doesn't matter. I don't expect perfection from anyone and that includes general authorities.

The bigger question is: why are you so condemning...showing no forgiveness?


There is a valid reason why this is a recurring theme in LDS critic/apologist discussions:

Thousands upon thousands of young Latter-Day Saints, while listening to Paul H. Dunn and his inspirational stories, experienced strong emotional reactions. Many, even perhaps an overwhelming majority of these people, ascribed those feelings as a manifestation of the truth of those things by the Holy Spirit.

The later revelation that Dunn's stories were not true cannot be used as an argument that the Holy Ghost does not or has not or can not witness the truth of things to a person of faith, but, it does force a rational person to conclude that those emotional feelings, which many LDS believe is the 'witnessing' by the Holy Ghost, can actually be false. In other words, while Dunn's legacy doesn't prove the Holy Ghost does not exist, it does prove that it is easy to be fooled into thinking a strong emotional reaction to a lie is a witness by the spirit.

And when it is that easy to mistake the two, there might as well not even be 'manifestation of the holy spirit'.

No leader of a sovereign country would print easy-to-counterfeit currency. The real stuff would become worthless because nobody can tell which is real and which is not. The same thing with angels and ghosts and still-small-voices. If you can't be sure your dealing with the genuine article, that you don't know how to tell the difference between the real-deal and an impostor, the system becomes worthless.

If the holy ghost is telling you to take a knife and sacrifice a child, and you aren't terribly certain it's THE holy ghost telling you... kinda defeats the purpose.

why me wrote:Who are they? I have never heard such a thing.

You claim to be a Mormon, but it's just like you've never even attended a single meeting.
eschew obfuscation

"I'll let you believers in on a little secret: not only is the LDS church not really true, it's obviously not true." -Sethbag
_why me
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Re: Speaking of Paul H. Dunn...

Post by _why me »

MsJack wrote:
why me wrote:The bigger question is: why are you so condemning...showing no forgiveness?

The same way you've forgiven 19th-century Protestants who harassed Mormons or turned a blind eye to their hardships by not bringing them up and using them to attack modern-day Protestants every chance you get?

Oh, wait . . .

why me wrote:I don't expect perfection from anyone and that includes general authorities.

Too bad it doesn't include your Protestant neighbors.


I have said many times that the frontier was a harsh place. And the frontier mind was not very tolerant. We can not at times separate ourselves from our social environment and many protestants could not do this. I really don't give the protestants at that time much thought. But their christian beliefs seemed to cloud their love of neighbor when we consider the Mormons, native-americans, catholics and jewish persecution that they were involved in.
I intend to lay a foundation that will revolutionize the whole world.
Joseph Smith


We are “to feed the hungry, to clothe the naked, to provide for the widow, to dry up the tear of the orphan, to comfort the afflicted, whether in this church, or in any other, or in no church at all…”
Joseph Smith
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