Apologists and Thomas Kuhn: A Love Story

[_Darth J]

I heard the other day that Brigham Young might still be alive.

I mean, I know he's buried in the ground in Salt Lake City and all, but that's just an interpretation. There are no facts.

[_Bob Loblaw]

And regarding Kuhn, if you again, actually read my post you will see that it was not my intent to summarize him but to place him in a context of ideas which influenced him. So saying I didn't understand him is ridiculous- I wasn't even talking about what his theories were, just where he got them.

You specifically equated Kuhn and his theory of paradigm shift with the Pragmatic notion that science is a "tool" that we create to solve problems. That turns Kuhn on his head. You also said:

Problems develop in theories because the theory doesn't match the new data, so a new theory must be developed to solve the problem. But it is always a human solution created by humans socially-

Kuhn's theory of paradigm shift is not about developing new theories to solve a problem. It is about the resistance people have to new data that does not match their preconceived notions. And even then, the "revolution" is simply shifting the paradigm just enough to accommodate the anomalies. Kuhn argues that it is the structure of our paradigms that governs the way we approach problems. According to you, Kuhn says that we create the structures in order to solve the problems.

I see no reason to believe you understand Kuhn except in a very superficial way.

[_Darth J]

What a critic of the church really has to show is that not only that Kuhn was "wrong" but that all of those who believe that the meaning of a proposition is based on its linguistic context and not on some relationship to "the world" were wrong.

Dang, did I call it or WHAT??

You sure did!!! If critics can't prove that Kuhn's ideas about paradigm shifting are wrong, then the Church is true!!!!

I suggest that you send this to the Ensign immediately!

[_Bob Loblaw]

You sure did!!! If critics can't prove that Kuhn's ideas about paradigm shifting are wrong, then the Church is true!!!!

I suggest that you send this to the Ensign immediately!

It's frustrating to have someone give you a Wikipedia-level (if that) summary of Kuhn and then insist that no one has the right to point out to him that he's misreading Kuhn. WTF?

[_Bob Loblaw]

Dang, did I call it or WHAT??

So, you believe I have no right to note that you have completely misread Kuhn and that my doing so is justification for you sneering?

I really can't stand it when people throw out names like Kuhn and expect us just to go along with their interpretation, especially when their interpretation is not even close to what that philosopher said.

[_Stormy Waters]

Dang, did I call it or WHAT??

This is brilliant mfbukowski. I am going to start using this technique. From now on when I make arguments I will always end by saying, 'I bet some people will disagree with my arguments.' Then if people disagree with my arguments I can say 'Dang, did I call it or WHAT??'

[_Darth J]

Dang, did I call it or WHAT??

This is brilliant mfbukowski. I am going to start using this technique. From now on when I make arguments I will always end by saying, 'I bet some people will disagree with my arguments.' Then if people disagree with my arguments I can say. 'I sure called that one didn't I?'

Southwest, henceforth I vow to always agree with you, so I can prove that you are wrong.

[_Bob Loblaw]

This is brilliant mfbukowski. I am going to start using this technique. From now on when I make arguments I will always end by saying, 'I bet some people will disagree with my arguments.' Then if people disagree with my arguments I can say. 'I sure called that one didn't I?'

Brilliant for sure. mfbukowski isn't a sockpuppet for Wade Englund, is he?

[_dblagent007]

Brilliant for sure. mfbukowski isn't a sockpuppet for Wade Englund, is he?

I was thinking the same thing. Bukowski is the philosopher version of Wade (you are incapable of understanding anything I say) Englund.

[_mfbukowski]

You specifically equated Kuhn and his theory of paradigm shift with the Pragmatic notion that science is a "tool" that we create to solve problems. ...

I never said that.