Did Abinadi care how the church would be represented on the highest level of public discourse, or did he boldly declare the truth of God?
You can ask him in the afterlife. I'm not going to speak for him.
But did He ever say anything which was untrue?
Yes, he said it was ok to eat with unwashed hands. The fact is, it's not ok. I don't think Jesus knew about germs.
But that's all beside the point. I wasn't there to hear everything Jesus ever said and did. What little records we have is just the tip of a big iceberg. We know very little about what Jesus said to the Jews.
Paul Osborne wrote:There never was a first God. Our Father has an infiinte number of Fathers who came before him. This works on the same principle that there are an infinite number of Gods to come into existence (out of Father's loins) in which there never will be a last Father. Eternity future is no different than eternity past because they are just as long - eternal. To the natural man it makes no sense to think that there is no first Father but this is because the natural man is mortal, earthbound, and ignorant of divine eternal principles. Except for me, of course. I know better. Ain't that right, harmony, dear?
Paul O
Did you watch "The Revenge of The Nerds" and think that 'Ogre' was inspired when he said "What if C-A-T really spelled dog?"
Big difference between things that you can 'know' and things that you feel or believe.
"Conciousness is expanded. the worlds of darkness gathered and beheld his brightness. They breathed his fragrance and orbited about him and bowed anew and worshipped him."
We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark; the real tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light. - Plato
Big difference between things that you can 'know' and things that you feel or believe.
I agree. The word "know" is bounced around a little too much in Mormonism. I'm careful not to overuse it. Using the word belief is often a better word to use.
But what about someone who has seen angels? Do they know or believe? Further, what about someone who has seen angels together at the same time and place with someone else? Is that not outside the realm of mere belief? It's reasonable to think that those persons know that angels exist, right?
Paul Osborne wrote:There never was a first God. Our Father has an infiinte number of Fathers who came before him. This works on the same principle that there are an infinite number of Gods to come into existence (out of Father's loins) in which there never will be a last Father. Eternity future is no different than eternity past because they are just as long - eternal. To the natural man it makes no sense to think that there is no first Father but this is because the natural man is mortal, earthbound, and ignorant of divine eternal principles. Except for me, of course. I know better. Ain't that right, harmony, dear?
Paul O
Now, Paul....brace yourself....don't faint...but this is one topic I actually AGREE with you about! LOL
Is lightning flashing? ;)
The eternal nature of God and man is something that we, as mortal beings, cannot wrap our minds around. This is one truth that will make perfect sense to us when the veil is lifted, but is impossible for us to comprehend now.
Paul Osborne wrote:Oh harmony, he is playing the press through carefully selected words and being wise like a serpent and harmless as a dove. Don't you get that? President Hinckley knows that God has a Father. He knows it has been taught and that it is established doctrine.
Paul O
Ozzy, you're mistaken. Hinckley himself said he doesn't know that. Here's the quote:
Q: Just another related question that comes up is the statements in the King Follett discourse by the Prophet.
Hinckley: Yeah
Q: ... about that, God the Father was once a man as we were. This is something that Christian writers are always addressing. Is this the teaching of the church today, that God the Father was once a man like we are?
Hinckley: I don't know that we teach it. I don't know that we emphasize it. I haven't heard it discussed for a long time in public discourse. I don't know. I don't know all the circumstances under which that statement was made. I understand the philosophical background behind it. But I don't know a lot about it and I don't know that others know a lot about it.
So, we're to believe that Hinckley doesn't "...know all the circumstances under which [the King Follett discourse] was made"?!?!? I've been pretty familiar with "the circumstances" that discourse was made since I was a Deacon. He's a lying rat bastard.
Nort
The truth is a lot easier to see when you stop assuming you already have it. - Me
You miserable worm, don’t you have enough sense to understand basic common sense?
“I don't know that we teach it”
The prophet isn’t aware of every specific point of doctrine discussed throughout the classes, quorums, and institutes within the worldwide Church. How can he say whether the point of doctrine in question is discussed? Is he there? Is he present? No, he is not.
“I don't know that we emphasize it”
If and when such doctrine is taught in any of the various assemblies throughout the Church the prophet can’t guage how much it’s emphasized. Whether it is said in passing or touched upon heavily is something the prophet just doesn’t know. He is not the all seeing eye.
“I haven't heard it discussed for a long time in public discourse”
He is correct about that. The last time he mentioned it in General Conference was in 1994.
“I don't know. I don't know all the circumstances under which that statement was made.”
Here we have a prophet that readily admits that he doesn’t know everything. That is fine by me.
“I understand the philosophical background behind it. But I don't know a lot about it and I don't know that others know a lot about it.”
Yes, the prophet does understand the fundamental philosophy of this doctrine. How well others do is anyone’s guess. The prophet can’t speak for others regarding how well they understand this doctrine or how much they know about it. This doctrine is set within an eternal framework and there is no man on this earth that knows a lot about that, including the prophet.
Now, Nort – you are a wicked worm. Repent if you know what’s good for you. Time is ticking away and the night soon comes when all will be dark.
Now, Paul....brace yourself....don't faint...but this is one topic I actually AGREE with you about! LOL
Liz,
You are therefore a member in the club of outspoken Internet Mormons who believe this doctrine. I haven't met very many who are in this club. Congrats!
You miserable worm, don’t you have enough sense to understand basic common sense?
“I don't know that we teach it”
The prophet isn’t aware of every specific point of doctrine discussed throughout the classes, quorums, and institutes within the worldwide Church. How can he say whether the point of doctrine in question is discussed? Is he there? Is he present? No, he is not.
“I don't know that we emphasize it”
If and when such doctrine is taught in any of the various assemblies throughout the Church the prophet can’t guage how much it’s emphasized. Whether it is said in passing or touched upon heavily is something the prophet just doesn’t know. He is not the all seeing eye.
“I haven't heard it discussed for a long time in public discourse”
He is correct about that. The last time he mentioned it in General Conference was in 1994.
“I don't know. I don't know all the circumstances under which that statement was made.”
Here we have a prophet that readily admits that he doesn’t know everything. That is fine by me.
“I understand the philosophical background behind it. But I don't know a lot about it and I don't know that others know a lot about it.”
Yes, the prophet does understand the fundamental philosophy of this doctrine. How well others do is anyone’s guess. The prophet can’t speak for others regarding how well they understand this doctrine or how much they know about it. This doctrine is set within an eternal framework and there is no man on this earth that knows a lot about that, including the prophet.
Now, Nort – you are a wicked worm. Repent if you know what’s good for you. Time is ticking away and the night soon comes when all will be dark.
Paul O
Sorry, Ozzy. Your "Prophet" is a lying bastard that refuses to admit that Mormons believe that God grew into Godhood and that they think they can become God's themselves. He's a douche and YOU'RE his bag.
Nort
The truth is a lot easier to see when you stop assuming you already have it. - Me