DiscussMormonism.com

One of the funny things about how the apologists rationalize Smith's bedding teenagers and other men's wives is their insistence that this was somehow a spiritual sealing and not sexual at all, despite so many of Joseph's wives having sworn affidavits that they had indeed done the deed with the prophet. Why, it's shocking, they tell me, to suggest that Joseph would have risked his life and the kingdom of God just for "a little nooky on the side" as one apologist put it.

As proof, they say, if he had all that sex, where are his children? As no definitive DNA studies have been done (though one has been long rumored), we have no idea where he deposited his seed successfully. And this is taken as proof that Joseph's marriages were pure and holy and not sexual at all.

But the other day our friend juliann pointed out that coitus interruptus was the rule of the day back in Joseph's time, that it was practiced regularly to avoid constant pregnancy. Given the speculation about his not actually having had sex with, say, Helen Kimball or Sarah Whitney, wouldn't there be just as much evidence that he had indeed been intimate but pulled out before the train left the station (sorry, but my TBM sister in law explained it to my wife this way before we were married, and it always makes me smile)? Indeed, which is the more likely reason for no children? A marriage with no sex, or a marriage that used the prevalent form of birth control?

Indeed, which is the more likely reason for no children? A marriage with no sex, or a marriage that used the prevalent form of birth control?

Or a union in which the man's sperm were sluggish, requiring frequently repeated relations unavailable in the hurried atmosphere of a secret plural marriage. Or a marriage where the women were already pregnant with their other husband's child. Or a marriage with a woman who wasn't ovulating at the time.

Lots of reasons, lots of excuses.

harmony wrote:

Indeed, which is the more likely reason for no children? A marriage with no sex, or a marriage that used the prevalent form of birth control?

Or a union in which the man's sperm were sluggish, requiring frequently repeated relations unavailable in the hurried atmosphere of a secret plural marriage. Or a marriage where the women were already pregnant with their other husband's child. Or a marriage with a woman who wasn't ovulating at the time.

Lots of reasons, lots of excuses.

And which applies here? I assume that evidence compels you.

Edited to add:

Gee I guess not.

My point was that, given the absence of evidence, there are no grounds for saying that Joseph never had sex with those women. At least no more grounds than for saying that there was some other reason for the lack of offspring. Given that my point posited a lack of evidence, just exactly which evidence are you asking for?

Why?

Well, my best guess is that there may very well be offspring from Joseph Smith but this is a different thread.

More to your point.... when a man is having sex with multiple women, he is sleeping with each one less frequently than one man with one women. If a man is secretely having sex with, say, thirty women, hiding, sneaking around etc, my guess is that he may only visit each woman other than the actual wife, every few months or so? The chances of impregnating these additional women with whom one only has sex with a few times a year is quite slim.

Just a guess... :-)

~dancer~

Just because a girl has reached menarche doesn't mean she's at peak fertility. This would be a factor for any 14-16 year olds Joseph Smith might have had sex with.

Perhaps because they were "tight like unto a dish"?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QWhFsDk7L4E