Is this a Lie?

[_Who Knows]

In Joseph Smith history we read this:

In the year 1823 my father’s family met with a great affliction by the death of my eldest brother, Alvin. In the month of October, 1825, I hired with an old gentleman by the name of Josiah Stoal, who lived in Chenango county, State of New York. He had heard something of a silver mine having been opened by the Spaniards in Harmony, Susquehanna county, State of Pennsylvania; and had, previous to my hiring to him, been digging, in order, if possible, to discover the mine. After I went to live with him, he took me, with the rest of his hands, to dig for the silver mine, at which I continued to work for nearly a month, without success in our undertaking, and finally I prevailed with the old gentleman to cease digging after it. Hence arose the very prevalent story of my having been a money-digger.

Others here probably know more about this than I do, but wasn't Joseph Smith known as a treasure digger prior to his work with Stoal? Didn't Stoal seek out Joseph Smith because he thought Joseph Smith could find buried treasure?

edit - to my knowledge, this is the only mention of Joseph Smith's treasure digging in the canonized LDS scriptures.

[_Runtu]

In Joseph Smith history we read this:

In the year 1823 my father’s family met with a great affliction by the death of my eldest brother, Alvin. In the month of October, 1825, I hired with an old gentleman by the name of Josiah Stoal, who lived in Chenango county, State of New York. He had heard something of a silver mine having been opened by the Spaniards in Harmony, Susquehanna county, State of Pennsylvania; and had, previous to my hiring to him, been digging, in order, if possible, to discover the mine. After I went to live with him, he took me, with the rest of his hands, to dig for the silver mine, at which I continued to work for nearly a month, without success in our undertaking, and finally I prevailed with the old gentleman to cease digging after it. Hence arose the very prevalent story of my having been a money-digger.

Others here probably know more about this than I do, but wasn't Joseph Smith known as a treasure digger prior to his work with Stoal? Didn't Stoal seek out Joseph Smith because he thought Joseph Smith could find buried treasure?

edit - to my knowledge, this is the only mention of Joseph Smith's treasure digging in the cannonized LDS scriptures.

I'd say it's a lie in the sense that it omits the reasons for his hiring (i.e., Stoal heard that Joseph could find treasure using a peepstone) and the fact that he used said peepstone for just that purpose. Joseph's account leaves the (false) impression that he was merely hired as a manual labor digging holes. And that would be a lie.

[_Who Knows]

I'd say it's a lie in the sense that it omits the reasons for his hiring (i.e., Stoal heard that Joseph could find treasure using a peepstone) and the fact that he used said peepstone for just that purpose. Joseph's account leaves the (false) impression that he was merely hired as a manual labor digging holes. And that would be a lie.

Exactly. And it leaves the (false) impression that the reason Joseph Smith was labeled a money-digger was because of his work with Stoal (where he was known as a money-digger prior to that).

[_Rollo Tomasi]

I'd say it's a lie in the sense that it omits the reasons for his hiring (i.e., Stoal heard that Joseph could find treasure using a peepstone) and the fact that he used said peepstone for just that purpose. Joseph's account leaves the (false) impression that he was merely hired as a manual labor digging holes. And that would be a lie.

I agree that, at the very least, this account was misleading as to Joseph's primary role in the search.

[_Jason Bourne]

In Joseph Smith history we read this:

In the year 1823 my father’s family met with a great affliction by the death of my eldest brother, Alvin. In the month of October, 1825, I hired with an old gentleman by the name of Josiah Stoal, who lived in Chenango county, State of New York. He had heard something of a silver mine having been opened by the Spaniards in Harmony, Susquehanna county, State of Pennsylvania; and had, previous to my hiring to him, been digging, in order, if possible, to discover the mine. After I went to live with him, he took me, with the rest of his hands, to dig for the silver mine, at which I continued to work for nearly a month, without success in our undertaking, and finally I prevailed with the old gentleman to cease digging after it. Hence arose the very prevalent story of my having been a money-digger.

Others here probably know more about this than I do, but wasn't Joseph Smith known as a treasure digger prior to his work with Stoal? Didn't Stoal seek out Joseph Smith because he thought Joseph Smith could find buried treasure?

edit - to my knowledge, this is the only mention of Joseph Smith's treasure digging in the canonized LDS scriptures.

I am not sure I would call it a lie per say. But there is much more to the money digging then that. Joseph and his father did seek treasure in the Palmyra vicinity well before this. He used his seer stone for this. In fact there was an informal partnership with other Palmyra residents. I refer you to Bushman's two books-Joseph Smith and the Beginning of Mormonism and Rough Stone Rolling for details.

In those books it is interesting to note that it seems that young Joseph was encouraged in this activity by Joseph Senior. Joseph eventually resisted his father's encouragement because he felt the activity was not complimentary to his calling as a prophet.

[_Who Knows]

I am not sure I would call it a lie per say. But there is much more to the money digging then that. Joseph and his father did seek treasure in the Palmyra vicinity well before this. He used his seer stone for this. In fact there was an informal partnership with other Palmyra residents. I refer you to Bushman's two books-Joseph Smith and the Beginning of Mormonism and Rough Stone Rolling for details.

In those books it is interesting to note that it seems that young Joseph was encouraged in this activity by Joseph Senior. Joseph eventually resisted his father's encouragement because he felt the activity was not complimentary to his calling as a prophet.

Why would you not call it a lie? This is Joseph Smith's story as given in the canonized LDS scriptures. In it, he says that he was branded a 'money-digger' because of his 'innocent' work in 'helping' stoal find a supposed silver mine. No other mention of his money-digging is mentioned in the LDS scriptures.

If it's not a lie, what is it?

[_Runtu]

I am not sure I would call it a lie per say. But there is much more to the money digging then that. Joseph and his father did seek treasure in the Palmyra vicinity well before this. He used his seer stone for this. In fact there was an informal partnership with other Palmyra residents. I refer you to Bushman's two books-Joseph Smith and the Beginning of Mormonism and Rough Stone Rolling for details.

In those books it is interesting to note that it seems that young Joseph was encouraged in this activity by Joseph Senior. Joseph eventually resisted his father's encouragement because he felt the activity was not complimentary to his calling as a prophet.

Either way, it's certainly a less-than-truthful account of it. I wonder if Joseph Senior might have inadvertently motivated Joseph to start his prophetic undertaking. It seems at least plausible that the man who encouraged him to use the peepstone might have encouraged him to more extensive endeavors.

[_Who Knows]

Definitions of a 'lie':

- A false statement deliberately presented as being true; a falsehood.
- Something meant to deceive or give a wrong impression.
- To present false information with the intention of deceiving.
- To convey a false image or impression.

I think this case fits somewhat with some of those - false information, false image, wrong impression, etc.

[_Jason Bourne]

I am not sure I would call it a lie per say. But there is much more to the money digging then that. Joseph and his father did seek treasure in the Palmyra vicinity well before this. He used his seer stone for this. In fact there was an informal partnership with other Palmyra residents. I refer you to Bushman's two books-Joseph Smith and the Beginning of Mormonism and Rough Stone Rolling for details.

In those books it is interesting to note that it seems that young Joseph was encouraged in this activity by Joseph Senior. Joseph eventually resisted his father's encouragement because he felt the activity was not complimentary to his calling as a prophet.

Why would you not call it a lie? This is Joseph Smith's story as given in the canonized LDS scriptures. In it, he says that he was branded a 'money-digger' because of his 'innocent' work in 'helping' stoal find a supposed silver mine. No other mention of his money-digging is mentioned in the LDS scriptures.

If it's not a lie, what is it?

Ok,

It is a lie.

[_Jason Bourne]

I am not sure I would call it a lie per say. But there is much more to the money digging then that. Joseph and his father did seek treasure in the Palmyra vicinity well before this. He used his seer stone for this. In fact there was an informal partnership with other Palmyra residents. I refer you to Bushman's two books-Joseph Smith and the Beginning of Mormonism and Rough Stone Rolling for details.

In those books it is interesting to note that it seems that young Joseph was encouraged in this activity by Joseph Senior. Joseph eventually resisted his father's encouragement because he felt the activity was not complimentary to his calling as a prophet.

Either way, it's certainly a less-than-truthful account of it. I wonder if Joseph Senior might have inadvertently motivated Joseph to start his prophetic undertaking. It seems at least plausible that the man who encouraged him to use the peepstone might have encouraged him to more extensive endeavors.

Have you read rough stone rolling? In that Bushman covers a lot about Joseph, his feelings for his father and that relationship and how it impacted Joseph and some of what he did.