DiscussMormonism.com

A few of my boardmates here, and others who, to my knowledge, don't post here, are simply ROCK!

In a current RfM thread on the topic of Joseph Smith's alleged "pedophilia," I held strongly that he was not a pedophile; and for this thought crime was labeled by a number as, of all things, an LDS "apologist"!

But Jersey Girl, Dr. Shades, DoubleHelix, Hiram Page, and Craig Criddle all suddenly appeared tonight as "character witnesses" for my true apostate credentials. It warms the cockles (assuming it has them) of my hellbound heart to know that my friends, colleagues, and boardmates would jump into the fray in my defense like that.

http://www.exmormon.org/boards/w-agora/ ... 1182555842

May the Void bless you all!

He of inflated cranium, Don :-)

You're welcome, sir!

Just happy to set the record straight. :-)

Recovery from Mormonism... geez, I remember what they did to Dan Vogel. There is such a mentality over there, and yet they are so sincere. Wait till they get wind of this at MADB if someone knows your handle.



The cockles of your heart... now, I always understood the cockles to be located a ways south of the heart, at least in males. Maybe you should get this "warming feeling" checked out by a professional.

The Dude wrote:There is such a mentality over there, and yet they are so sincere. Wait till they get wind of this at MADB if someone knows your handle.

I dunno, all in all I have Exmormon.org to thank for my courage to stand up to the church and tell them they have no right to demand my time, money and emotion.

Don,

Heh, don't feel badly. It's happened to me more than once over there.

Funny, I was in the original exmo email group that Eric K formed as an offshoot of the AOL religion folder, and then I participated regularly on the RFM board when it was first put together for quite a while - at least a year or two. But if I dare show up over there and voice an opinion contrary to the Wise Ones over there, I'm also attacked and called a closet believer.

There is a real party line mentality over there. Of course, there are individual posters who won't parrot the party line, and they get razzed regularly, too. But, at the same time, there are quite a few knowledgeable people over there, and that's why I still look in now and then.

A while ago I also tangled with them about calling Joseph Smith a pedophile. Heaven knows, I'm not a fan of Joseph Smith' character, but there really isn't any good evidence he was a pedophile. If he were a pedophile, we would see a pattern of his marrying very, very young girls. He certainly could have done it. Yet he didn't. He had a few young wives, but the only one that it is even POSSIBLE was prepuberty was Helen Mar. That is not the pattern of a pedophile. (I don't even believe he had sex with Helen Mar for various reasons, mainly her strong reaction as a realization of what her marriage meant which occurred because she wasn't allowed to go to a dance, which occurred eight months after her marriage... I think if she'd been having sex with Joseph Smith already for those eight months, she would have been able to figure out already what the marriage meant, she wasn't stupid. I think Joseph Smith was doing what fundamentalist polygamists do today, which is set aside and hoard certain young women to marry them when they go through puberty) For that, SLCabbie told me I was mentally disturbed, completely messed up due to my Mormon upbringing (note to cabbie: I wasn't raised LDS). Another time I protested against those who attacked Dan Vogel and his pious fraud theory... I believe that was when I was called a closet believer. I was personally attacked in so many ways that I can't remember them all. Oh yes, I was also called a b*tch.

So I very rarely post there, anymore, even though every time I've done so, some posters ARE supportive in taking a stand against the party line. It's no more worth it than MAD is. In fact, MAD and RFM are quite similar in temperament. (just different vocabularies and opposite party lines)

beastie wrote:So I very rarely post there, anymore, even though every time I've done so, some posters ARE supportive in taking a stand against the party line. It's no more worth it than MAD is. In fact, MAD and RFM are quite similar in temperament. (just different vocabularies and opposite party lines)

That's very true, Trixie. They are polar opposites of each other, yet so similiar, it's eerie. Not that I spend much time at either site, since I'm banned from one and avoid the other. Still, when posted on RFM, I was vilified as a believer, while at the same time posting on LDS boards and vilified as an evil apostate.

I'm an RfM poster who weighed in on that thread. Unfortunately, my initial reaction was uneducated. I don't know Don at all, though I do know Long Gone 2 who started the thread on RfM. She's in real life a very lovely and helpful woman who has assisted me personally. I tend to agree with her that Joseph Smith may have been a pedophile and it's pure speculation on whether or not he had sex with Helen Mar. Men generally have sex with their wives. Not having sex with one's wife is the anomaly so it's my opinion that Smith had sex with his plural wives, even the ones married to other men and the fourteen year old unless there's some good evidence to the contrary of which I'm unaware. Helen's not attending a dance isn't good enough evidence for me to assume Smith didn't have intercourse with her.

Later yesterday evening, I came to this board to look for Don's posts and found them to be educated and reasonable, if not a bit flirty. :P (I'm guilty of that myself.) I posted that same opinion over on RfM (sans the flirty bit). I do not believe Don is any kind of apologist for the Mormon church. Don, I do not doubt your credentials one bit. Your intellect and integrity are vouched for by your friends here on MD, but you don't really need their vouching. After reading many of your posts here and on other boards your intellect and integrity speak for themselves.

I'm not certain what I think about Smith being a pedophile. I am certain Don is no LDS apologist.

Good luck having a dissenting opinion on RfM. I'm a regular poster there and often agree with the majority opinion of the board, but whenever I mention anything that goes against the grain, they go berserk. It's just how the place is.

KA

I saw that thread....RfM irritates me from time to time. They make our dogpiles look like love taps.

Sorry you had to take that crap Don. Next time I'll have your back dawg ;)

Just a quick question - who were the antagonizers over on exmo.org that attacked you?

I posted a comment on the follow up thread.

http://www.exmormon.org/boards/w-agora/ ... b_recovery

I understand that people who are just discovering that the LDS church is not what it claims, and they have invested inordinate amounts of time, money, and life-style choices in a religion that is just as man-made as the others, are going to be angry. I was angry. And they may need a place to vent - better vent there than in real-life. The problem as I see it is the mix of this emotional venting with discussions that should be academic, not personal, like whether or not it is justified to call Joseph Smith a pedophile.

I suggested dividing the board into two forums, one for venting alone, and one just for academic discussions about LDS truth claims.

I have no idea if anyone who could follow up on it would find it worthwhile, but I would reconsider participating there if they did so (because I do have information I think can help doubters or investigators concerning the Book of Mormon in Mesoamerica). I can't participate there regularly in the state it is currently in, and believe it probably drives as many people away as MAD does.