Analytics wrote:I’d love it if every tourist was required to fill out a comment card that asked what they thought of the temple, with several responses on a scale from “divine” to “creepy”.
They kind of did that with the survey back in the late 80's (which most likely led to the temple changes). I would love to see some of the responses.
WK: "Joseph Smith asserted that the Book of Mormon peoples were the original inhabitants of the americas"
Will Schryver: "No, he didn’t." 3/19/08
Still waiting for Will to back this up...
Gazelam wrote:I wish the endowment ceremony was longer myself. The Temple is a school, and I'd love for more of it to be spelled out. Alot of whats in the Temple is symbolic, and you can spend your whole life tryign to take it all in.
I'm with you on this. The ritual performances of the temple are very spiritual in nature, sadly there are some who don't attain to a level where they can benefit from these blessings because they are worldly. These people would have felt the same way about Moses’ temple and any other sanctuary built unto Jehovah in days of old.
The endowment is all about Christ and our devotion to him. Those who don’t get that are spiritually stunted.
Paul O
It's easy to convince yourself that something is spiritual in nature when everybody else around you seems to believe it is. If you have negative thoughts about these higher ordinances, there must be something wrong with you, you are not spiritual enough, etc. I remember in my TBM days thinking many parts of the endowment were very bizarre but I wouldn't have dared admit that to another endowed member for fear of being judged by people like you. The reality is, most LDS feel the same as me but are not going to discuss it and are not allowed to outside of the Celestial room. My TBM DH admitted to me that his first experience through the temple was not positive, and he went after 1990. He will blame himself by saying he hadn't been spiritually prepared enough, but the truth is that the Masonic rituals feel cultish and are distracting to the spirit and peace you can feel in the temple. (which is why they continue to change the endowment and removed the parts that are creepy )
"Happiness is the object and design of our existence... That which is wrong under one circumstance, may be, and often is, right under another." Joseph Smith
Seven wrote: (which is why they continue to change the endowment and removed the parts that are creepy )
Not all the creepy parts are gone, which is why I prefer to sit in the chapel and meditate, rather than take a session. I refuse to veil my face, I refuse to bow my head and say "yes", I refuse wait my turn at the veil like a good girl waiting for her treat.
barrelomonkeys wrote:Paul, I mentioned in the thread in Celestial that one of the only places (in a church setting) where I felt at peace and close to God was a bare bones country chapel. It is a very small country chapel with no ornamentation. The simplicity of the bare wood floors and pews were beautiful to me.
Don't you think that God can be found in many places?
Sure, God was even found in the dank pit under Liberty jail. Therein a great revelation was given to the prophet Joseph Smith.
I've experienced the peace of God in many settings - but I do enjoy the quiet atmosphere found in the temple where one is able to point all their energy towards God while performing rites and ordinances. The temple has been a great blessing for me.
Paul Osborne wrote:The endowment is all about Christ and our devotion to him.
Then why do we consecrate everything to the church, not Christ? Why does Christ need a mediator to stand between his siblings and himself?
Harmony,
Read the scriptures. Yes, open them up and read them. Learn about how Christ talked about how important his Church was and how the apostles continued to run his Church after his death and how they had all things in common.
Read about how important it is to have apostles and prophets to guide us in our earthly journey. Now, if you take out of the scriptures all the parts about prophets and apostles helping man get closer to God you won't have much left to tell anything. Honestly, sometimes I think that is what you really want.
Paul Osborne wrote:The endowment is all about Christ and our devotion to him.
Then why do we consecrate everything to the church, not Christ? Why does Christ need a mediator to stand between his siblings and himself?
Harmony,
Read the scriptures. Yes, open them up and read them. Learn about how Christ talked about how important his Church was and how the apostles continued to run his Church after his death and how they had all things in common.
Read about how important it is to have apostles and prophets to guide us in our earthly journey. Now, if you take out of the scriptures all the parts about prophets and apostles helping man get closer to God you won't have much left to tell anything. Honestly, sometimes I think that is what you really want.
Paul O
Of course there wouldn't be much there without all the parts about prophets and apostles, Paul. Who do you think wrote them? Prophets and apostles! That doesn't mean they're necessary for salvation or exaltation; that just means men want to feel important.
If the church was run like Christ ran his church, you'd see few complaints from me. That's what was promised to me when I got baptised, but that's not how it is. Far from it, actually. I don't recall ever reading in any scriptures about church leadership buying real estate, investing in stock portfolios, having their children educated with tithing dollars, or taking the heart of the gospel and twisting it into something unrecognizable. I seem to remember advice to love your neighbors, not exclude them. I seem to remember some bits about taking care of the poor and widowed, instead of building up riches.