Sebaztyan wrote:I am a member of the church I also have been dealing with SSA (same sex attraction) for as long as I can remember. I am faithful and temple worthy. I have a delima though and it is really eating at me. I encounter the cruelest persecution from inside the church. My own Brothers and sisters do hateful acts to me because of thier fear and ignorance. They even go as far as tell the bishop they don't think I am worthy. But I have no sexual realations at all and I don't show any affection to guys unless they ask for it ( hugs and back massages only, I give great back rubs, to guys and girls!). I am being discriminated in my own place of solace and no one cares how I feel. Am I a non-person?
Well anyway, my dilema is what action should I take if any. The bishop doesn't seem to care if rumors go around and hurt me. Should I confront those people or let them slide. It drives me mad. They wouldn't call a black member the "n" word and tell everyone to watch thier backs and then make up crazy stories about him and tell the bishop they were uncomfortable with him cause he's black. That would he hateful.That would be so unchrist-like. So wy should it be different for me. I am "gay". I choose not to live that way and choose to live the gospel regardless. So to always assume that any guy who is "gay" is a sex feind ready to nab any guy he meets, isn't that the same hateful discrimination? I never did anything to any of these people and yet they go out of thier way to hurt me.
I am ready to leave the church all together. I f I didn't know it was true I would go. But I know it is and I know the Lord will make al things right in the end. I endure. Even thorugh all the persecution I recieve in my place of solace I am still here.
I am sorry I am venting but I would like to know your opinions on if I should confront those people.
Thanks
Sebaztyan
Some of the responses were kind, such as this one from Severian:
Severian wrote:I think the ward, the Bishop and the Church have a duty to care for all of their flock, whether they are homosexual, disabled or green. As long as they are all Children of God, then this duty should extend to all.
A poster called Rick gave this advice:
This is sexual harrassment, plain and simple.
1. I would inform anyone you catch slandering your worthiness and address them by stating that you do not appreciate such statements. (I would record the name of the individual, time and date.)
2. If the individual makes a similiar statement again, record the time and incident and report to the Bishop. By law he must act. The individual has been warned by you that you do not appreciate such actions.
3. If the Bishop fails to act in a reasonable amount of time, (two weeks) with an appropriate form of action, such as a formal talking with threat of disfellowship if such action continues, take it to the Stake President.
4. If it has escalated and the Stake President fails to act, take it outside the church to your local Gay and Lesbian chapter and they will know which is the appropriate trustworthy law enforcement or District Attourney to contact to file a complaint against the local church leadership.
This is beyond rehensible.
Humorously, he was chastized, quite severely, by Pahoran for this:
Pahoran wrote:Have you ever read the Bible, Rick? The Saints are supposed to work out their differences in-house. We are not supposed to drag each other into secular courts. We are certainly not supposed to use threats and legal coercion in order to exercise unrighteous dominion over the Lord's servants. Secular courts have no jurisdiction in ecclesiastical matters, and no-one who values religious liberty wants to give them any.
Finally, the thread was shut down by Skylla:
Skylla wrote:No personal threads.
Skylla
What's a guy like Sebaztyan to do? If you know anything about MAD, and about struggling TBMs, then you know the answer is: Start another thread, of course! His next OP is as follows:
Sebaztyan wrote:Just curious. Whats wrong with personal threads? There is alot of great information and lessons learned through people's personal experiences. Also, it promotes free agency and freedom of speach? This is not a post to oppose the guidelines , just curious as to the reasoning.
Sebaztyan
Great question! Here's Slacktime's hypocritical reply (and it makes me wonder if Skylla is a Slacktime sockpuppet):
(emphasis added)Slacktime wrote:We don't allow a thread to be centered around a specific poster (although there have been exceptions... the Bill Keller thread is an example of an exception) because it rarely builds understanding and generally becomes a ad hominem bash on one side or the other.
Personal experiences are often used to discuss topics and this is fine. We just don't want threads saying "I like the postings of <insert fav name>. Kapish?
-SlackTime
Ah, I see. Thank you for clarifying, ST. Personal threads are no bueno if they demonstrate LDS prejudice, but if they are aimed at smearing a critic, then they are A-okay. I thought so! (Note to SlackTime: it is spelled "capiche.")
Next, Skylla swoops in and shuts down this thread:
Skylla wrote:We don't allow personal threads because they usually lead to personal attacks. Thread closed.
Skylla
Come now, Skylla! Why aren't you being as honest and forthright as SlackTime? Why not just say, "We only allow personalized attacks on critics."
In a last-ditch effort, Sebaztyan gives it one last try, this time rephrasing his question by addressing concrete Church policy, in a thread called, "Discrimination In The Church: Handbook":
(red moderator text ibid)Sebaztyan wrote:What does the handbook say about how to deal with discrimination in the church?
This is your last warning about bringing your personal agenda to this board. Thread closed again.
How intriguing! Does anyone want to take bets on how long it will be before Sebaztyan defects to a more sympathetic (and less censorious) forum? Further, it is nice to see such an apparently naïve admission from SlackTime on how biased the MADmoderating team really is. All in all, a fascinating turn of events. Also, it seems that there is a rather deep homophobic streak which runs through the MAD community (and by extension the LDS community). But did anyone really need to be told that?
(Special thanks to my confidential informant for bringing this to my attention.)