Let's play Mormon Mythbusters! Episode 1: Castrations

[_KimberlyAnn]

Okay, we've all heard strange Mormon myths and oddball stories which seem too far fetched to be true. Of course, as a young girl I heard that Joseph Smith stared at a rock in his hat to "translate" the Book of Mormon and it seemed too far fetched to be true, but it wasn't! I also believed God himself and his son, Jesus, visited a little boy in New York and told him to start a new church, but, oddly enough, that seemed perfectly reasonable to me. So, over the past three years, I've been doing quite a bit of Mormon myth busting of my own. I've redetermined what I consider reasonable and have, in general, become much more skeptical. My husband would say I've become cynical.

Now, lets "cut" to the chase: Castrations. I've read that in the early days of the Mormons settling Utah there were several men castrated, one by his own Bishop, over issues regarding polygamous wives or infidelity. I do not remember where I read it, and there are literally hundreds of Mormon related books and journals and articles in my home and I don't have the kind of time it would take to dig up the reference, which I'm not sure would be reliable even if I were to find it.

Does anyone have the references for such castrations easily accessible? Are they reliable? Can we confirm or bust the myth of Mormon Castrations?

Thanks for the help,

KA

[_Mercury]

Okay, we've all heard strange Mormon myths and oddball stories which seem too far fetched to be true. Of course, as a young girl I heard that Joseph Smith stared at a rock in his hat to "translate" the Book of Mormon and it seemed too far fetched to be true, but it wasn't! I also believed God himself and his son, Jesus, visited a little boy in New York and told him to start a new church, but, oddly enough, that seemed perfectly reasonable to me. So, over the past three years, I've been doing quite a bit of Mormon myth busting of my own. I've redetermined what I consider reasonable and have, in general, become much more skeptical. My husband would say I've become cynical.

Now, lets "cut" to the chase: Castrations. I've read that in the early days of the Mormons settling Utah there were several men castrated, one by his own Bishop, over issues regarding polygamous wives or infidelity. I do not remember where I read it, and there are literally hundreds of Mormon related books and journals and articles in my home and I don't have the kind of time it would take to dig up the reference, which I'm not sure would be reliable even if I were to find it.

Does anyone have the references for such castrations easily accessible? Are they reliable? Can we confirm or bust the myth of Mormon Castrations?

Thanks for the help,

KA

Its in Abanes book

[_Doctor Steuss]

[...]
Does anyone have the references for such castrations easily accessible? Are they reliable? Can we confirm or bust the myth of Mormon Castrations?

Thanks for the help,

KA

"Warren Snow was Bishop of the Church at Manti, San Pete County, Utah. He had several wives, but there was a fair, buxom young woman in the town that Snow wanted for a wife. He made love to her with all his powers, went to parties where she was, visited her at her home, and proposed to make her his wife. She thanked him for the honor offered, but told him she was then engaged to a young man, a member of the Church, and consequently could not marry the old priest. This was no sufficient reason to Snow. He told her it was the will of God that she should marry him, and she must do so; that the young man could be got rid of, sent on a mission or dealt with in some way so as to release her from her engagement--that, in fact, a promise made to the young man was not binding, when she was informed that it was contrary to the wishes of the authorities.
The girl continued obstinate. The "teachers" of the town visited her and advised her to marry Bishop Snow. Her parents, under the orders of the Counselors of the Bishop, also insisted that their daughter must marry the old man. She still refused. Then the authorities called on the young man and directed him to give up the young woman. This he steadfastly refused to do. He was promised Church preferment, celestial rewards, and everything that could be thought of--all to no purpose. He remained true to his intended, and said he would die before he would surrender his intended wife to the embraces of another.
This unusual resistance of authority by the young people made Snow more anxious than ever to capture the girl. The young man was ordered to go on a mission to some distant locality, so that the authorities would have no trouble in effecting their purpose of forcing the girl to marry as they desired. But the mission was refused by the still contrary and unfaithful young man.
It was then determined that the rebellious young man must be forced by harsh treatment to respect the advice and orders of the Priesthood. His fate was left to Bishop Snow for his decision. He decided that the young man should be castrated; Snow saying, "When that is done, he will not be liable to want "

This is from "THE LIFE AND CONFESSIONS OF THE LATE Mormon BISHOP, JOHN D. LEE; ALSO THE TRUE HISTORY OF THE HORRIBLE BUTCHERY KNOWN AS THE MOUNTAIN MEADOWS MASSACRE" (How's that for a title). It is taken from page 285.

[_Doctor Steuss]

One more thing. The previous line to the above quote reads:

"As an illustration I will refer to an instance that many a good Saint knows to be true."

To the best of my knowledge, Lee is the only person that documented this act that "many a good Saint knows to be true."

But... despite this shortcoming, (and given human nature), I think that it is possible (although likely not very probable based on the scant evidence) that this did indeed occur.

Does anyone know of any other contemporary source for the Bishop Snow instance, or am I correct that Lee is all there is?

[_KimberlyAnn]

Thank you, Mercury and Dr. Steuss. I thought I read an account of the castration in someone's diary which included notes on a meeting with Brigham Young regarding whether or not Bishop Snow should be retained as a Bishop after it was discovered he had someone castrated. I most certainly could be wrong.

I don't have time to look for it today, and probably won't until Sunday afternoon. If I can find the reference I'm thinking of I'll post it, but I could be remembering incorrectly.

KA

[_moksha]

He was promised Church preferment, celestial rewards, and everything that could be thought of--all to no purpose.

Same as the promise to the Kimballs in exchange for young Helen Mar, eh?

In one of Dr.Michael Quinn's history books, he discusses this story, plus mentions quotes from a Provo Bishop talking about this castration, on the orders of Bishop Snow, as a way to keep the Provo boys in line. Quinn also mentions how Brigham Young's brother urged President Young to take action against Bishop Snow, but how President Young eschewed this advice, because he thought the Church had need of men with Bishop Snow's willingness to do what needed to be done.

[_KimberlyAnn]

Does anyone know of any other contemporary source for the Bishop Snow instance, or am I correct that Lee is all there is?

I bet Don Bradley would know.

Will you help us out, Don?

KA

[_Doctor Steuss]

KimberlyAnn,
You are welcome. I hope you are able to find the other source over the weekend, and I’d be interested in reading it (if you can find it... but I know the difficulties of dredging through mountains of books to find a given tidbit). There very well may be other sources, but as stated before, to the best of my knowledge Lee is the only contemporary source. (But, given my propensity for being incorrect, and my extensive drug use in the past, I could most certainly be wrong).


…and Moksha,

Could you provide a page number (and book) if you get a chance? I’d like to see what sources Quinn is utilizing and whether or not they are contemporary and/or dependant upon Lee. Methinks it would be pretty groovy if there was more out there (that I'm just not aware of) as Lee’s account is pretty brief for what would seem to be quite the sordid event.

Does anyone know of any other contemporary source for the Bishop Snow instance, or am I correct that Lee is all there is?

I bet Don Bradley would know.

Will you help us out, Don?

KA

Ah, how could I forget about the Oracle of Bradley.

Don,
If you help us out with this, I'll make you an honorary Steussite.

[_Bond...James Bond]

Dang, you stole my ideer. I was totally going to do a parody where the Mythbusters attempt to replicate Joseph's run through the woods with the Gold Plates.

[_KimberlyAnn]

Dang, you stole my ideer. I was totally going to do a parody where the Mythbusters attempt to replicate Joseph's run through the woods with the Gold Plates.

Bond, you silly man, this is only episode one! You have to do your parody, it sounds hilarious!

I love Mythbusters. And I kinda have a crush on the "Dirty Jobs" guy. Well, I have crushes on almost all the guys on the Discovery Channel. Oh, God. Ray's right! I am a dumb blonde!

KA