Page 1 of 3
Warren Jeffs, unsealed papers; he quit as Prophet
Posted: Wed Oct 31, 2007 3:08 pm
by _Alter Idem
But then he retracted it. This is an article from today's Deseret News and it's pretty damaging.
http://www.deseretnews.com/article/1,51 ... 60,00.html
Here are excerpts;
Fundamentalist LDS Church leader Warren Jeffs renounced his role as "prophet" of the polygamist sect in a series of phone calls to family and followers, and again in a videotaped jailhouse conversation with his brother, according to court documents unsealed Tuesday.
But he later retracted his renouncement, saying he had "experienced a great spiritual test."
Those were some of the revelations in the court documents unsealed by the judge handling the criminal case.....
The documents were originally filed under seal in July by Jeffs' defense attorneys, who successfully fought to keep the jailhouse statements sealed before the trial. Judge James Shumate had said the jailhouse recordings were so inflammatory they could have affected the FLDS leader's right to a fair trial.
However, the series of court filings dating back for months were suddenly made public Tuesday without explanation when they were posted on the Web site of the Utah State Courts.....
"On January 24, 2007, the Defendant made a series of phone calls to family and church members in which he related that when he was 20 years old, he had been immoral with a sister and a daughter," Bugden wrote. "He renounced his role as the Prophet, explaining that the Lord revealed to him that he was a wicked man and has not held the priesthood since he was 20 years old."
The people to whom Jeffs spoke responded that he was the prophet and that he was merely "being tested." Jeffs did not elaborate on the "immoral conduct" of 31 years ago, Bugden wrote.
Posted: Wed Oct 31, 2007 3:11 pm
by _Alter Idem
Ziodberg and Evolving beat me to it!! You gotta be fast around here!:)
Re: Warren Jeffs, unsealed papers; he quit as Prophet
Posted: Wed Oct 31, 2007 3:16 pm
by _harmony
"On January 24, 2007, the Defendant made a series of phone calls to family and church members in which he related that when he was 20 years old, he had been immoral with a sister and a daughter,"
A sister? A
daughter? I think I'm going to be sick.
Posted: Wed Oct 31, 2007 3:17 pm
by _Zoidberg
Alter Idem wrote:Ziodberg and Evolving beat me to it!! You gotta be fast around here!:)
Maybe the mods can put the three threads together for us?
Posted: Wed Oct 31, 2007 3:33 pm
by _Who Knows
Alter Idem wrote:This is an article from today's Deseret News and it's pretty damaging.
Nothing a little mental gymnastics and apologetics can't get around.
Remember - adjust the paradigm to fit your 'spiritual witness'.
Posted: Wed Oct 31, 2007 3:48 pm
by _Blixa
Thanks Alter Idem, Zoidberg, et. al. Because of my research my head is really in the past---I haven't read the newspapers once while I've been in SLC. Its a very interesting, though pretty icky, story....
Re: Warren Jeffs, unsealed papers; he quit as Prophet
Posted: Wed Oct 31, 2007 4:00 pm
by _Alter Idem
harmony wrote: "On January 24, 2007, the Defendant made a series of phone calls to family and church members in which he related that when he was 20 years old, he had been immoral with a sister and a daughter,"
A sister? A
daughter? I think I'm going to be sick.
From what I've read, incestuous sexual abuse is a serious problem among this group of polygamists.
I started the same thread on the MADB board--but it was ignored. Smac starts a thread on the same topic an hour later and suddenly everone over there wants to discuss it. I guess I know where I fit on the MADB hierarchy!!
Anyway, from that thread, people were wondering about the "sister" "daughter" statement. The "sister" could likely be a half or step sister--I'm sure Warren had quite a few. I don't know when Warren was first married, but he could have been married to a woman who already had children--so it could have been a step-daughter. I think I'll have to see what I can find on his marriages. I know that when he became Prophet, he married some of his father's young wives--which was forbidden up to that time.
Re: Warren Jeffs, unsealed papers; he quit as Prophet
Posted: Wed Oct 31, 2007 4:05 pm
by _SatanWasSetUp
harmony wrote: "On January 24, 2007, the Defendant made a series of phone calls to family and church members in which he related that when he was 20 years old, he had been immoral with a sister and a daughter,"
A sister? A
daughter? I think I'm going to be sick.
Only because of "presentism." Why are you judging events from 30 years ago based on the morailty of today? Besides, look at the Bible. God had sex with his 14 year old daughter. If you're going to accuse Jeffs of immorality, you also need to accuse God of the same thing. Or maybe you don't believe in the Bible, or even God *shudder*. I received spiritual confirmation that Jeffs is a prophet, and that's the only evidence that matters. You don't understand, because you've never received a spiritual confirmation.
Posted: Wed Oct 31, 2007 4:13 pm
by _evolving
when I saw this on the news last night - I had flashbacks to the all of the publicity the little community of Hilldale received during the olympics, and the tom Green trial.. the 48 hours special that filmed and showed a fundie sacrament meeting which was near identical to an LDS meeting including announcements for mutual activities and testimonies, same green hymbooks in the same purple covered pews...
I wonder how all of the FLDS followers feel today after learning all of their P-hood ordinances - baptisms - blessings - prophcies - sealings - originated and performed by an admitted incestious loving, child molesting, fraud artist --
oh silly me - I have a great position for empathy... sheesh what was I thinking :)
Re: Warren Jeffs, unsealed papers; he quit as Prophet
Posted: Wed Oct 31, 2007 4:14 pm
by _Alter Idem
SatanWasSetUp wrote:harmony wrote: "On January 24, 2007, the Defendant made a series of phone calls to family and church members in which he related that when he was 20 years old, he had been immoral with a sister and a daughter,"
A sister? A
daughter? I think I'm going to be sick.
Only because of "presentism." Why are you judging events from 30 years ago based on the morailty of today? Besides, look at the Bible. God had sex with his 14 year old daughter. If you're going to accuse Jeffs of immorality, you also need to accuse God of the same thing. Or maybe you don't believe in the Bible, or even God *shudder*. I received spiritual confirmation that Jeffs is a prophet, and that's the only evidence that matters. You don't understand, because you've never received a spiritual confirmation.
*sigh* So I guess this is going to turn into something to bash the LDS church with? I was actually interested in a discussion about the FLDS...