DiscussMormonism.com

Well, the other night after having finished teaching, I was on my way to the weekly Thursday pub evening with my students, and a missionary stopped me on the sidewalk to discuss religion. I stopped. We talked.

I asked him if he had any cool flyers to hand out. I told him I already had the “Why is the grass green?” card. He said he had all kinds of cards and handed me several of them. I didn’t have a lot of time to talk to him (darn it!) so I didn’t look at the cards until I was in the tram.

One of the cards really caught my interest. I am a smoker and on the front of the card is a picture of a fist tightening around a pack of cigarettes. The cigarettes are spilling out of the box as it is being crushed.

Then, below the picture, is the caption: “Moechten Sie gerne mit Democrat Rauchen aufhoeren?” (Would you like to give up smoking?). Below that is an offer for a free workshop to help quit smoking in seven (7) days. Then, it says for further information check the back of the card.

I turned the card over and ….nothing, but the address of the local church on Tiergartenstrasse, with the worship times: every Sunday at 9:00, together with the telephone number.

Well, I felt up for a little investigation into the free workshop. So, I first contacted Mormon.org. I figured (and who could blame me?) that if the church could help people get off smoking in seven (7) days, that was a program I wanted to know all about.

The discussion I had with Elder Porter (isn’t that funny?) at Mormon.org and then Sister Lamoreaux (the pinch hitter) is posted below in its entirety.

I also called the number and actually reached the same missionary who had handed me the card the other night. We had a good chat. Apparently, the program may only be a mission-wide program. Actually, he didn’t know for sure, but he felt so.

I asked him about the specifics of the program. Apparently, it is some paper with perhaps up to 15 points to help someone. He wouldn’t read them all to me, but number one on the list was, yes, you guessed it, prayer.

The second: avoid temptation.

Another point on the list was to drink grape juice or other juice high in Vitamin-C.

He felt the list was too long to read so he promised to send it to me by e-mail. If he ever does send it, I will be sure to post it for all those on the board wishing to give up tobacco.

Hey monkeys, we should do this, no?






Timothy:
Hi. My name is Tim.

Nicole:
Has transferred you to:

Elder Porter:
Hello, how can I help you today?

Timothy:
I have a few questions?

Elder Porter:
Hi, Tim.

Timothy:
Hi, Elder Porter

Elder Porter:
I will be glad to help you.

Timothy:
Thank you.

Timothy:
I work in Germany on a university campus.

Timothy:
I met some missionaries at the bus stop one evening.

Timothy:
They gave me a card about how to stop smoking in seven days. I wanted to ask you about this program. Is this a worldwide thing or just offered in Germany?

Timothy:
Hello?

Timothy:
Elder Porter, are you there?

Elder Porter:
I’m still here.

Timothy:
OK. Could you understand my question?

Elder Porter:
I haven’t actually heard of that card. Let me see if anyone else has.

Elder Porter:
Yes I understand.

Timothy:
The card says that the church offers a free workshop to help someone get off smoking
in 7 days.

Timothy:
And to contact the church.

Timothy:
I thought I would ask the headquarters and see what they are offering.

Elder Porter:
Ok, I know a little bit about that. Have you tried to contact the church?

Timothy:
Well, I am contacting you.

Timothy:
You are the church, I presume?

Elder Porter:
Did the card give you a specific number or just this website?

Elder Porter:
Yes, I am a member of this church.

Timothy:
It has a stamp on the back giving an address of the church on Tiergartenstrasse and Sunday opening times (9:00). Is that the time that church starts at that chapel?

Timothy:
Yes, it has a telephone number as well.

Elder Porter:
I would imagine.

Timothy:
But do you know anything about this seven day program? I have a smoking habit.

Elder Porter:
I know that if you were to go to that church on Sunday you will find people that will be more than willing to help you.

Elder Porter:
I personally am not familiar with the program and what it entails.

Timothy:
You mean that this is a local program, not a church-wide program? Do you know?

Timothy:
How would the people help me?

Timothy:
I have several other cards here as well.

Timothy:
One about Family Home Evening, another about baptism, etc.

Timothy:
Do you know about these cards?

Elder Porter:
I’m sure that they would encourage you to rely on our Savior Jesus Christ and help you overcome that addiction. I know that when we rely on our Savior we can accomplish things that we never thought were possible.

Timothy:
So are you saying that that is the program?

Timothy:
…to rely on the Savior?

Timothy:
You seem to have a strong testimony? It’s impressive.

Elder Porter:
Like I said, I’m not sure what the program entails. I’m sure that they have skilled people that will help you with the addiction part of it, while receiving help from church leaders about the importance of our Savior and his personal role in our lives.

Timothy:
Ok. That makes sense. So some kind of combined psychological-religious type counseling?

Elder Porter:
I do have a strong testimony of our savior Jesus Christ. I also know that we have a loving Father in Heaven that loves us so much! He is willing to help us with anything when we turn to him for help.

Timothy:
Hey, Elder Porter,

Elder Porter:
Yes.

Timothy:
Are you serving a mission now? Or is this a job?

Timothy:
I have a question about something a missionary said here the other night. Can I ask that?

Elder Porter:
I am called as a full time missionary. I am preparing to leave for France to serve my mission.

Timothy:
How’s the language coming?

Timothy:
Tough, I imagine.

Elder Porter:
You bet.

Timothy:
How much longer before you leave?

Elder Porter:
It’s coming a lot better than I thought it would.

Timothy:
That’s good. Good for you.

Elder Porter:
One week.

Timothy:
Soon!

Timothy:
Leaving a gal?

Elder Porter:
Thank you. You mentioned that you are meeting with the missionaries, right?

Timothy:
I met them on the street but didn’t have time to chat much. But he did raise something I would like to ask you now, if I may?

Elder Porter:
Of course.


Timothy:
Thank you. He said that the peep stone and the urim and thummim were the same thing. I said baloney. He had never heard of the prophet’s peep stone. Can you believe that?

Timothy:
I mean, he did have a peep stone, didn’t he?

Timothy:
Or am I mistaken?

Elder Porter:
I don’t know. I personally am not familiar with the peep stone….

Timothy:
Elder Porter?

Timothy:
You mean you haven’t seen it?

Timothy:
Hello?

Elder Porter:
Hi Timothy. This is Sister Lamoreaux. Can you please restate your question for me?

Timothy:
Ok. I have an easier question.

Elder Porter:
Hi! This is Sister Lamoreaux. What can I help you with?

Timothy:
Hi Sister Lamoreaux. Yes, I can restate it.

Timothy:
Here I go. Well, I met a missionary the other night that didn’t seem to know that the peep stone and the urim and thummim are not the same thing. He said they were. I said they weren’t and that you can see the stone in the museum in SLC. Which of us are correct? Or are we both wrong?

Timothy:
Hello?

Timothy:
Hello?

Timothy:
What happened to Sister Lamoreaux?

Timothy:
Elder Porter?

Elder Porter:
I don’t know a lot about the peep stone but I know that it was different than the Urim and Thummim.

Timothy:
What happened to Sister Lamoreaux?

Timothy:
What did he use the peep stone for?

Elder Porter:
This is her.

Timothy:
Ok.

Timothy:
What did he use the urim and thummim for?

Elder Porter:
Some people think he used it to help translate the Book of Mormon but we don’t know.

Timothy:
We don’t know?

Timothy:
What do “we” know?

Elder Porter:
He used it to translate.

Timothy:
You mean he used the stone to translate?

Timothy:
…translate the Book of Mormon?

Elder Porter:
Some people think he used the peep stones to translate the Book of Mormon. However, we know that the urim and thummim were used to translate.

Timothy:
Did he translate with neither of them at times?


Elder Porter:
And we don’t know for sure if the peep stone was used.

See following post---Part Two

PART TWO

Timothy:
Ok. Fair enough. Can I ask you about the Word of Wisdom?

Timothy:
I am a smoker.

Elder Porter:
Yes.

Timothy:
What exactly is forbidden?

Timothy:
And why?

Elder Porter”
http://scriptures.LDS.org/en/dc/89
(This URL is opening in the browser window that you opened the chat window from.)]

Timothy:
Yeah, I know that scripture. It doesn’t say coffee or tea, for example.

Timothy:
I don’t get it.

Timothy:
Do you get it?

Elder Porter:
We read in verse 9 that hot drinks are not for the belly. I know that it is a commandment of God and that my life has been blessed from following this commandment.

Timothy:
You don’t drink hot chocolate?

Timothy:
Warm apple cider?

Timothy:
Really?

Elder Porter:
It is important to know that Joseph Smith was a prophet and that he was called of God. He received this revelation directly from God.

Timothy:
Well, that would indeed be important.

Elder Porter:
We know through modern revelation that we are to abstain from certain drinks.

Timothy:
So, back to the Word of Wisdom: is Coke Ok?

Elder Porter:
Coffee and tee included.

Timothy:
So, how about coke?

Timothy:
Dr. Pepper

Timothy:
Green tea, cold?

Timothy:
Hot barley tea?

Timothy:
Decaff coffee?

Timothy:
Caffeine pills?

Timothy:
Hello? Sister?

Timothy:
Are you going on a mission, too?

Elder Porter:
There is no specific revelation that says that we shouldn’t drink Coke or Dr. Pepper. But we do know that we are supposed to abstain from anything that is addicting for us.

Timothy:
Where is the specific revelation about coffee and tea?

Elder Porter:
I know, through prayer, the things that I am supposed to do. I want you to learn the same. Have you prayed to our Heavenly Father?


Timothy:
How do I do that?

Elder Porter:
We believe that prayer is a way for us to communicate with our Heavenly Father. We start out by addressing him.

Timothy:
What do you want me to do?

Timothy:
…to pray now?

Timothy:
Ok. I will get down on my knees. Then what?

Elder Porter:
Yeah.

Elder Porter:
I will send you a brief explanation.

Timothy:
By letter?

Timothy:
Do you need my address?

Timothy:
So, should I still stay on my knees?

Elder Porter:
http://www.Mormon.org/mormonorg/eng/basuc-be

Timothy:
Ok. Thanks a lot.

Timothy:
And then what?

Elder Porter:
No.

Timothy:
No?



Timothy:
Hey Sister, are you still there? Maybe I can ask you about the first question I posed to Elder Porter, about the 7-day free workshop to stop smoking in 7 days. What do you know about it?

Timothy:
Hello?

Timothy:
You must be busy?

Elder Porter:
I’m here.

Timothy:
Lots of people calling with questions, probably?

Elder Porter:
I don’t know a lot about it. What I do know is that through relying on the Savior for help we can overcome anything in this life.

Timothy:
So, you mean you don’t know anything about the 7-day program?

Timothy:
Workshop?

Timothy:
It is on a missionary card. You know those, right?

Timothy:
All different themes and different questions and pictures, etc.

Elder Porter:
Not a lot. I do know that they have certain tips that have helped people in the past like substituting some other activity for smoking.

Timothy:
But this card says “workshop”.

Elder Porter:
If you are interested in the program I would suggest you go to the workshop.

Timothy:
So you are saying there is such a thing?

Timothy:
It just says to visit the church at 9 on Sunday morning.

Elder Porter:
I’m sorry I’m not familiar with that card. I’m sure if you contact the local missionaries they can tell you whether or not there is a workshop.

Elder Porter:
I will send you the link to request that the missionaries contact you.

Timothy:
Ok. So it is not a world wide program then?

Elder Porter: (sends me a link to some stupid site).

Timothy:
Are you ditching me now?

Timothy:
I had more questions.

Elder Porter:
No I’m not. However, the missionaries in your area can answer any questions you might have as well.

Timothy:
Well, the guy I spoke with didn’t know about the peep stone. I don’t trust him. Must be one of the lazy ones, huh?

Elder Porter:
I believe we already discussed this question.

Timothy:
Never read anything obviously!

Timothy:
Are you getting impatient?

Timothy:
…with me?

Elder Porter:
No, we already discussed this though.

Timothy:
Your response seemed a little short.

Elder Porter:
That is all I know. Sorry.


Timothy:
No, we were discussing this Elder’s laziness for not knowing. That is different than the first discussion.

Elder Porter:
I’m sorry but the purpose of this site is to answer questions about the restored gospel of Jesus Christ.

Timothy:
Is it the Sister I am talking with now?

Timothy:
And the peep stone has no connection?

Timothy:
To the restored Gospel?

Timothy:
Of Jesus Christ?

Timothy:
Hello? Are you serious?

Elder Porter:
There are other doctrines that are more important to learn about and gain a confirmation of first.

Timothy:
My question is directly related. Why did you now answer again somewhat abruptly?

Timothy:
Which are? Name them!

Timothy:
Name the important doctrines that I must know first, please.

Timothy:
Hello?

Elder Porter:
If you know that Joseph Smith was a prophet and he translated the Book of Mormon by the power of God, does it matter what the peep stones were used for?

Timothy:
Yes!

Timothy:
Why doesn’t it matter to you?

Timothy:
Tell me how you know, please.

Elder Porter:
(sends me again to some site)

Timothy:
What’s the site about?

Timothy:
I asked you how you know.

Elder Porter:
About how you can know for yourself

Timothy:
Right.

Timothy:
Explain it to me.

Elder Porter:
That web page gives a great explanation about how you can learn for yourself.

Timothy:
So, you can’t do it?

Timothy:
So, you haven’t had it yet?

Timothy:
How do you know?

Elder Porter:
I’m sorry but I have to go. I would invite you to read the page I sent you and contact the local missionaries if you have further questions. Have a great day!

Who needs comedy when you've got this stuff?

If you hear back from the local misssionaries, be sure to let us all know about the program to stop smoking in seven days, Gramps. I think I've heard of it before--something about brushing teeth with cinnamon toothpaste and drinking lots of orange juice.

I don't smoke, but should I start, I'd like to be able to quit easily. ;)

KA

I told him I already had the “Why is the grass green?” card.

I've never heard of that one. What is it?

KimberlyAnn wrote:If you hear back from the local misssionaries, be sure to let us all know about the program to stop smoking in seven days, Gramps. I think I've heard of it before--something about brushing teeth with cinnamon toothpaste and drinking lots of orange juice.

I don't smoke, but should I start, I'd like to be able to quit easily. ;)

KA

I will definitely let you know about this miracle program, if and when he ever sends me the information.

So that's what I need to be doing? Cinnamon toothpaste? Who would have known?

Thanks for the tip!

asbestosman wrote:

I told him I already had the “Why is the grass green?” card.

I've never heard of that one. What is it?

Hey man. How did you miss that one?

Just check on the first page of the terrestial forum and look for a post started by gramps.

Something about missionaries on German university campuses. It is in the OP.

By the way, I am collecting these cards now and would be happy to send you one if you so desire?

gramps wrote:

KimberlyAnn wrote:If you hear back from the local misssionaries, be sure to let us all know about the program to stop smoking in seven days, Gramps. I think I've heard of it before--something about brushing teeth with cinnamon toothpaste and drinking lots of orange juice.

I don't smoke, but should I start, I'd like to be able to quit easily. ;)

KA

I will definitely let you know about this miracle program, if and when he ever sends me the information.

So that's what I need to be doing? Cinnamon toothpaste? Who would have known?

Thanks for the tip!

Aversion therapy. The most common one I've heard about is to rinse your mouth with Listerine and then drink a glass of grapefruit juice, every time you would normally reach for a cigarette. That one worked for my sister.

harmony wrote:

gramps wrote:

KimberlyAnn wrote:If you hear back from the local misssionaries, be sure to let us all know about the program to stop smoking in seven days, Gramps. I think I've heard of it before--something about brushing teeth with cinnamon toothpaste and drinking lots of orange juice.

I don't smoke, but should I start, I'd like to be able to quit easily. ;)

KA

I will definitely let you know about this miracle program, if and when he ever sends me the information.

So that's what I need to be doing? Cinnamon toothpaste? Who would have known?

Thanks for the tip!

Aversion therapy. The most common one I've heard about is to rinse your mouth with Listerine and then drink a glass of grapefruit juice, every time you would normally reach for a cigarette. That one worked for my sister.

Well, that sounds as good as any.

I guess I will take my Listerine and my grapefruit juice to school and in between classes try it out.

As well as to the pub. Huummh! Listerine, grapefruit juice and weiss bier. Sounds super. I will probably be too sick to smoke after trying that mixed drink!

gramps wrote:Hey man. How did you miss that one?

Just check on the first page of the terrestial forum and look for a post started by gramps.

Something about missionaries on German university campuses. It is in the OP.

By the way, I am collecting these cards now and would be happy to send you one if you so desire?

Don't know how I missed it, but I did. How embarassing those questions are. Why is the grass green? Because God made it that way? That's hardly an answer. It doesn't explain why the grass isn't purple instead. Why should I be nice to others? Because God said so? I'm guessing the missionaries haven't heard of the Euthopyrrean dillema.


Hey, the missionaries once stopped me while here in Washington state while I was waiting for a bus to go home. I showed them my temple recommend, but next time I'm gonna string 'em along with a bunch of hard questions. I think after throwing an easy one about grass pigmentation (and maybe autumn leaf colors), I'll ask them about the how the atonement can possibly work as a debt analogy when if I'm in debt a little bit but have enough to pay the bigger debt of several other people--why could I not then also pay for my own debt (ie, why did Jesus have to be sinless to pay for our sins)?

And to really trip 'em up, I might ask whether our spirits are trichromates like our physical bodies (do spirits see the colors of the rainbow, or do they see ultraviolet and infrared too and distinguish hue as well as brightness)?

gramps wrote:
Hey monkeys, we should do this, no?

Haha! I was reading it and thinking - whoa cool, maybe I could use this? Then I see you thought of me. Awww... :)

Can we pray together via skype? ;)