Can someone explain this to me?

[_Scottie]

I know I'm not the brightest crayon in the box, but can someone help me understand the reason why charitable organizations are allowed to keep their books closed to the public?

I know Charity said something about not allowing the government to destroy religions, but that makes no sense to me. Don't most other mainstream religions have a financial report available to the public? Are they in jeopardy of destruction?

How does financial disclosure open the door to destroying the religion? Why was this law enacted?

[_Mercury]

I know I'm not the brightest crayon in the box, but can someone help me understand the reason why charitable organizations are allowed to keep their books closed to the public?

I know Charity said something about not allowing the government to destroy religions, but that makes no sense to me. Don't most other mainstream religions have a financial report available to the public? Are they in jeopardy of destruction?

How does financial disclosure open the door to destroying the religion? Why was this law enacted?

From Wikipedia:

The church has organized several tax-exempt corporations to assist with the transfer of money and capital. These include the Corporation of the Presiding Bishop of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, organized in 1916 under the laws of the state of Utah to acquire, hold, and dispose of real property. In 1923, the church incorporated the Corporation of the President of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints in Utah to receive and manage money and church donations. In 1997, the church incorporated Intellectual Reserve, Inc. to hold all the church's copyrights, trademarks, and other intellectual property. The church also holds several non-tax-exempt corporations. See Finances of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.

[_charity]

I, like the Founding Fathers, am very skeptical of the powers of government. The power to tax is the power to destroy, etc. Limit the government intrusion into your life and institutions, public, private, etc. as much as possible.

[_Scottie]

I, like the Founding Fathers, am very skeptical of the powers of government. The power to tax is the power to destroy, etc. Limit the government intrusion into your life and institutions, public, private, etc. as much as possible.

That is hogwash. Taxes are a necessity for running a country. Every other business is taxed, yet they aren't destroyed. Individuals are taxed, we're not destroyed. Why do you think a religion would be destroyed just by showing their finances??

I'm all for charitable organizations being tax exempt. Since the money is all donated from individuals that have paid taxes on it already, I see no need to tax it again.

This doesn't answer the question though. Why are charitable organizations allowed to hide their finances?

[_charity]

I, like the Founding Fathers, am very skeptical of the powers of government. The power to tax is the power to destroy, etc. Limit the government intrusion into your life and institutions, public, private, etc. as much as possible.

That is hogwash. Taxes are a necessity for running a country. Every other business is taxed, yet they aren't destroyed. Individuals are taxed, we're not destroyed. Why do you think a religion would be destroyed just by showing their finances??

Ever hear any of the real horror stories of the abuses of the IRS?

I'm all for charitable organizations being tax exempt. Since the money is all donated from individuals that have paid taxes on it already, I see no need to tax it again.

This doesn't answer the question though. Why are charitable organizations allowed to hide their finances?

Why does anyone have any right to look at them? The people who are concerned are the ones who donate. If they distrust the organization, they don't have to donate. It is a matter of choice. And for those who don't want to donate and don't, it is none of their business.

Is it just idle curiosity on the part of the peole who demand to look at the books?

[_Scottie]

Ever hear any of the real horror stories of the abuses of the IRS?

Some, yes. Does that mean that we shouldn't have taxes?

Why does anyone have any right to look at them? The people who are concerned are the ones who donate. If they distrust the organization, they don't have to donate. It is a matter of choice. And for those who don't want to donate and don't, it is none of their business.

Is it just idle curiosity on the part of the peole who demand to look at the books?

Stop being so defensive! I'm not even talking about the LDS church here. I'm talking about the law and any charitable organizations. I'm trying to understand what the roots of this law are. What problem is it trying to solve?

I'm simply asking why this law exists? You made mention of the founding fathers earlier. Has this been a law since the founding fathers signed? If so, what was their purpose in keeping charitable organizations financials a secret? Was there some problem in the old world that they were trying to rectify?

[_The Nehor]

I really wish we could do away with the old 16th amendment. A federal sales tax would be so much easier to manage.

[_the road to hana]

I know Charity said something about not allowing the government to destroy religions, but that makes no sense to me. Don't most other mainstream religions have a financial report available to the public? Are they in jeopardy of destruction?

Most other large mainstream religions do make their financials available to the public, whether publishing them in newspapers or posting them online, or both. I've seen several both in print and online, enough to realize this is the norm and the LDS Church's approach is the exception.

Members of other churches just take it in stride and are used to the financials being audited and matters of public record. I imagine there would be more danger to those churches if they weren't in full financial disclosure.

[_Who Knows]

Why does anyone have any right to look at them? The people who are concerned are the ones who donate. If they distrust the organization, they don't have to donate. It is a matter of choice. And for those who don't want to donate and don't, it is none of their business.

You make a good point. This is why some private companies don't get audited - because the owners (the ones who own the stock) generally have access to the books. However, with public companies, your average shareholder does not have access to the books. Thus, an audit is performed to provide assurance to them that the company's books are properly accounted for.

For religions it's a different story - we, the taxpayers, are subsidizing the religion. Thus, we deserve the right to inspect the books (have an audit performed). Pay your share of taxes, and i don't give a crap whether you're audited or not (if i'm not donating money to the religion).

[_Who Knows]

I'm simply asking why this law exists? You made mention of the founding fathers earlier. Has this been a law since the founding fathers signed? If so, what was their purpose in keeping charitable organizations financials a secret? Was there some problem in the old world that they were trying to rectify?

Not all charitable organizations' financials are a secret. Only religious organizations.

If you're just a regular charitable organization (ie., american cancer society), you have to disclose your financials to the IRS, and those records are public. An exemption is made for religious organizations (the salvation army is organized as a religious organization, so you don't see their financials).

It's something to do with the government not interfering in religion (by having their financials disclosed, and taxing them). But that's simply ridiculous to me. It's like religions have rights that you and me don't. It's crazy.