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In a peripheral discussion with Charity on the "Personal Story of My Father's Temple Sealing" thread, Charity asserted that I didn't "know much about the reason why LDS do genealogy and temple work." I am moving that part of the discussion here.


I replied, "I know all about it. I know at least as much as you do about it, and possibly even more. I know what the rank and file of LDS membership believes are the reasons for it, too."

Her response? "The only problem here is, what you think you know is not correct."



So I challenged her, Which of the following is not correct?

Here was her response:
(Charity's responses in red)

*LDS temple work is done ostensibly to provide ordinances for the living and the dead.

Leave out the "ostensibly."

Using the word "ostensibly" does not make it less correct. So that's one.

*LDS temple work for the living involves initiatory ordinances, endowments and sealings of spouses and family members. Certain other ordinances, including Second Anointings, take place on a limited basis inside LDS temples.

Right.

Two.

*LDS temple work for the dead involves baptisms, confirmations, initiatory ordinances, endowments and sealings of spouses and family members.

Right.

Three.

*LDS members do genealogy work in order to learn more about their ancestors and to obtain the names of those ancestors in order to facilitate that ordinances are performed in LDS temples on their behalf.

Right.

Four.

*LDS members are generally endowed with a sense of well being for accomplishing genealogical research and temple work for and on behalf of those who are dead.

You'd have to ask them. It is probably different for different people.

I used the word "generally" for a reason. Five.

*LDS members must meet a set of requirements to receive a current recommend to attend an LDS temple in order to perform work for the living and the dead. Included in those requirements is the payment of a full, faithful and honest tithe.

That's one of a dozen.

I used the word "included" for a reason. Six.

*LDS members who do not meet the requirements for current temple recommends are generally encouraged by other faithful members to do what they can in order to be worthy of holding a current temple recommend, including paying a full, faithful and honest tithe.

Along with the dozen others. I don't know of a general "encouragement." Maybe family members, priesthood leads, but I don't know of any member who goes up to another and tries to encourage them to do what they can. . . ..

"Generally encouraged by other faithful members" is consistent with "family members, priesthood leaders." It does not necessarily mean all members.

Seven.

*New converts to the LDS Church cannot go through an LDS temple for their own endowments or to perform proxy work for the dead until a year after their baptism into the church (they can, however, do proxy baptisms for the dead before that time).

With your correction, that is right.

Eight.

*LDS members believe that all those who have lived without benefit of hearing the gospel of Jesus Christ personally and being baptized into the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints in this life need to have their ordinances performed by proxy by those who are living.

Generally correct. I don't think any member believes that everyone will accept it. We do it for everyone we know of, because we don't have the wisdom to know who accept and who doesn't.

I made no statement regarding acceptance. Nine.

*In order to get the names of all those who have lived, including those now dead, the LDS Church encourages its members to at minimum research their family histories for at least four generations, and do more if possible.

Right.

Ten.

charity wrote:

the road to hana wrote:Please tell me, what of the above is incorrect, in your view?

You can mouth it all. But you think that it is all a premeditated ploy to keep LDS in a sort of thralldom. That is what you don't understand.

Tell me again, which of the above were incorrect? None.

Thanks for reinforcing what I said. You can parrott all the facts, but you stlil say the purpose of temples is to get money out of the Saints.

"With all thy getting, get understanding."

charity wrote:Thanks for reinforcing what I said. You can parrott all the facts, but you stlil say the purpose of temples is to get money out of the Saints.

"With all thy getting, get understanding."

You agreed with every single point I made, and I made no others.

the road to hana wrote:

*LDS members who do not meet the requirements for current temple recommends are generally encouraged by other faithful members to do what they can in order to be worthy of holding a current temple recommend, including paying a full, faithful and honest tithe.

Along with the dozen others. I don't know of a general "encouragement." Maybe family members, priesthood leads, but I don't know of any member who goes up to another and tries to encourage them to do what they can. . . ..

I find this to be incorrect. No one except the bishopric knows who has a recommend and who doesn't, so no one would know who to encourage. We all know that the people who attend the temple have one, but we don't know if those who don't attend don't have one or if they simply aren't attending for another reason. And since no one outside of the bishopric knows who has a recommend and who doesn't, it stands to reason that no individual member is encouraged to do what is necessary to gain one. The only encouragement I've ever seen is for the whole ward, not an individual member.

As Winter reported, her uncle was a heroin addict, and he had a temple recommend. We don't know just because of what we observe if a person has one or not.

harmony wrote:

the road to hana wrote:

*LDS members who do not meet the requirements for current temple recommends are generally encouraged by other faithful members to do what they can in order to be worthy of holding a current temple recommend, including paying a full, faithful and honest tithe.

Along with the dozen others. I don't know of a general "encouragement." Maybe family members, priesthood leads, but I don't know of any member who goes up to another and tries to encourage them to do what they can. . . ..

I find this to be incorrect. No one except the bishopric knows who has a recommend and who doesn't, so no one would know who to encourage.

Two comments, harmony.

First, do you think wives who have husbands who aren't temple worthy don't "encourage" them to become so? Do you think husbands who have wives who aren't temple worthy don't do the same?

Active children who have parents who aren't temple worthy? Parents who have adult children who aren't temple worthy?

Second, are you suggesting that never from the stand in LDS meetinghouses is it suggested or encouraged during leaders' or members' talks that members do what they can to make themselves worthy to attend the temple and receive its blessings? That never do GA's stress the same at General Conference or in church magazine articles?

Both you and Charity are interpreting my comments to mean, apparently, that the rest of the ward throngs down upon the unsuspecting non-temple-worthy member. That wasn't what I was suggesting. But most non-worthy members who have family who are worthy, will find they are encouraged to remedy that. And most members who are non-worthy are encouraged by leadership generally to do the same.

So, Charity multiple choice, which is it?

A. nitpick

B. nit-pick

C. nit pick

D. All of the below.