Page 1 of 5
what makes a seerstone?
Posted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 8:44 pm
by _Sethbag
I'm curious about seerstones from the faithful perspective.
Is it something about a particular stone that makes it suited to functioning as a seerstone? Or would any stone do?
I'm just curious. Joseph Smith found the seerstone at the bottom of a well he was helping dig. Could he have just gone down to the creek and found any old nice, smooth, round stone and used that instead? Did it have to be that particular stone from the bottom of the well?
Has God placed a small quantity of very specific, very special stones in the Earth specifically to be found by certain Prophets (or Prophet) who would be able to use them?
I'm just curious whether you guys believe it was something about the nature of that particular stone that made it possible to use as a seerstone, or if the power of God to animate stones in magical ways extended to being able to do it with any old random piece of rock.
ps: was his ass cold when he found that seerstone? I'm just wondering, in light of the old saying...
Posted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 8:48 pm
by _RebelYell
since Joseph Smith was full of crap, any stone would have done the trick.
Posted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 8:57 pm
by _the road to hana
This is one of the funnier posts I've read on seer stones and teaching about them in Mormonism.
http://abev.wordpress.com/2006/01/20/seer-stone-memo/
Posted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 9:03 pm
by _SatanWasSetUp
I imagine the seer stone was simply a catalyst that allowed Joseph Smith to realize his prophetic powers, much like the "magic feather" on Dumbo, and much like the Egyptian scrolls allowed him to receive an unrelated revelation about Abraham. Anything can work as a catlyst. I suppose he could've used a wand, like Harry Potter, to summon up his magic powers, or a staff like Gandalf. Joseph simply chose to use a stone.
Posted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 9:07 pm
by _silentkid
If I recall correctly, The Nehor has some experience with seer stones. He may be able to provide an insightful answer.
Posted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 9:20 pm
by _Sethbag
SatanWasSetUp wrote:I imagine the seer stone was simply a catalyst that allowed Joseph Smith to realize his prophetic powers, much like the "magic feather" on Dumbo, and much like the Egyptian scrolls allowed him to receive an unrelated revelation about Abraham. Anything can work as a catlyst. I suppose he could've used a wand, like Harry Potter, to summon up his magic powers, or a staff like Gandalf. Joseph simply chose to use a stone.
I've suggested in the past that given the catalyst theory (for seerstones, or egyptian papyrus, or whatever, as you say) Joseph Smith could have "translated" a dozen donuts into some marelous scripture, and by LDS apologetic logic, that would be a good translation.
Posted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 9:28 pm
by _Trinity
There are all sorts of scrying tools. Could Joseph have used any of these other than a stone and gotten the same result? Would these also be acceptable forms (from a believer's perspective) to receive communications from God? If no, why not?
crystal ball
black or dark mirrors
crystals
pendulums
cups of treacle or ink
ouiji boards
Edited to add that I just read Runtu's seerstone and must have missed the original discussion If my post repeats material already covered, I apologize.
Posted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 9:33 pm
by _The Nehor
silentkid wrote:If I recall correctly, The Nehor has some experience with seer stones. He may be able to provide an insightful answer.
I don't think the stone has any specific power. However God has used items as catalysts for revelation. The Liahona, the Urim and Thummim, the Ark, the Temples. Some would say garments, the sacrament, and consecrated oil fit in this category. I don't know if certain objects have some inherent holiness property but I doubt it. These items are not magic in the sense that they work on a simple physical principle of cause and effect. While God may require prerequisites from the user for them to work they work as he commands. In my experience demonic power is even more fickle and less dependable.
I've mentioned before that I want a seerstone but so far God has not led me to one or honored my attempts with a random rock. I'm not sure if I'm spiritually above or beneath the use of such an object. Probably both.
Posted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 9:33 pm
by _asbestosman
silentkid wrote:If I recall correctly, The Nehor has some experience with seer stones. He may be able to provide an insightful answer.
I don't remember him saying anything about seer stones. I do remember him talking about kidney stones though.
Re: what makes a seerstone?
Posted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 9:37 pm
by _Mercury
“Once Martin found a rock closely resembling the seerstone Joseph sometimes used in place of the interpreters and substituted it without the Prophet's knowledge. When the translation resumed, Joseph paused for a long time and then exclaimed, ‘Martin, what is the matter, all is as dark as Egypt.’ Martin then confessed that he wished to ‘stop the mouths of fools’ who told him that the Prophet memorized sentences and merely repeated them” (Godfrey, 11).