Cognitive Dissonance -- It Sucks

[_Moniker]

So, over the last year I've struggled quite a bit with cog dis. This is really the only time in my life that I've had to deal with this. I would assume a few of you dealt with this as well -- attempting to rationalize, deny, etc... certain facts when they conflicted with "feelings" or prior beliefs.

Along with that I struggled with double think which sucks as well. Sort of bouncing between two contradictory beliefs. I actually recognized I was doing this and attempted to sort it out which became quite difficult to do.

The power of holding two contradictory beliefs in one's mind simultaneously, and accepting both of them . . . . To tell deliberate lies while genuinely believing in them, to forget any fact that has become inconvenient, and then, when it becomes necessary again, to draw it back from oblivion for just so long as it is needed, to deny the existence of objective reality and all the while to take account of the reality which one denies — all this is indispensably necessary. Even in using the word doublethink it is necessary to exercise doublethink. For by using the word one admits that one is tampering with reality; by a fresh act of doublethink one erases this knowledge; and so on indefinitely, with the lie always one leap ahead of the truth.

I would assume that a few (or a lot) of you on this board dealt with this and had to at some point no longer rely on "feelings", and rationalizations in order to see the "truth". Was denial something that you dealt with when confronted with history or unsavory aspects of the Church that you had to come to terms with?

Was this a difficult process for you?

I just want to state again -- it sucks!

[_Ray A]

I would assume that a few (or a lot) of you on this board dealt with this and had to at some point no longer rely on "feelings", and rationalizations in order to see the "truth". Was denial something that you dealt with when confronted with history or unsavory aspects of the Church that you had to come to terms with?

Was this a difficult process for you?

I haven't disregarded my feelings, nor "the truth". Living with the tension of belief/unbelief, is what makes the journey exciting. I doubt, yet in some way I still believe.

[_charity]

And those of you who have decided to relieve your stress by leaving the Church have still not overcome the cogn dis problem. Many, many of you (maybe not all) still have a kernel of truth hiding in your souls, and you still know deep down that the Church is true. Which is why Elder Maxwell pointed out the problem you have. "You can leave the Church, but you can't leave it alone."

[_Moniker]

I would assume that a few (or a lot) of you on this board dealt with this and had to at some point no longer rely on "feelings", and rationalizations in order to see the "truth". Was denial something that you dealt with when confronted with history or unsavory aspects of the Church that you had to come to terms with?

Was this a difficult process for you?

I haven't disregarded my feelings, nor "the truth". Living with the tension of belief/unbelief, is what makes the journey exciting. I doubt, yet in some way I still believe.

So you just rely on faith, Ray? I couldn't handle the doubting part -- that would drive me bonkers. Matter of fact it has been.... :)

[_Moniker]

And those of you who have decided to relieve your stress by leaving the Church have still not overcome the cogn dis problem. Many, many of you (maybe not all) still have a kernel of truth hiding in your souls, and you still know deep down that the Church is true. Which is why Elder Maxwell pointed out the problem you have. "You can leave the Church, but you can't leave it alone."

How do you know that, Charity? Is it possible that some of these people absolutely KNOW that the Church is false? That they absolutely believe that God is not evident and that Joseph Smith was a fraud?

If you rely on faith why can't others rely on facts?

[_Ray A]

So you just rely on faith, Ray? I couldn't handle the doubting part -- that would drive me bonkers. Matter of fact it has been.... :)

Mon, I know this will sound silly, doesn't almost all faith? This is what I emailed to a friend:

Think of that part in the Indiana Jones movie where he comes to a divide, with a deep crevice, and he has to cross over to get to the Holy Grail. There's no bridge, and the obvious thought is that should he take that "leap of faith" he will fall to his death if the bridge doesn't appear. But the bridge isn't going to appear until he actually takes the step, so it's a real leap of faith, until he steps and the bridge appears. This is why I don't ridicule belief, because to those who think it absurd, there is an "inner truth" the believer has strongly sensed, and experienced, even if he can't explain it convincingly or rationally, or even live it properly. To mock sacred things is the height of human folly. I view unbelief and mockery of Mormonism as silly as unbelievers think Mormonism is, and even sillier. The "conviction" of the unbeliever is on no more stable ground than the believer.

As Paul said, faith is foolishness to the unbeliever. But I don't see anything foolish in it, and I respect it.

[_Moniker]

So you just rely on faith, Ray? I couldn't handle the doubting part -- that would drive me bonkers. Matter of fact it has been.... :)

Mon, I know this will sound silly, doesn't almost all faith? This is what I recently posted to a friend:

Think of that part in the Indiana Jones movie where he comes to a divide, with a deep crevice, and he has to cross over to get to the Holy Grail. There's no bridge, and the obvious thought is that should he take that "leap of faith" he will fall to his death if the bridge doesn't appear. But the bridge isn't going to appear until he actually takes the step, so it's a real leap of faith, until he steps and the bridge appears. This is why I don't ridicule belief, because to those who think it absurd, there is an "inner truth" the believer has strongly sensed, and experienced, even if he can't explain it convincingly or rationally, or even live it properly. To mock sacred things is the height of human folly. I view unbelief and mockery of Mormonism as silly as unbelievers think Mormonism is, and even sillier. The "conviction" of the unbeliever is on no more stable ground than the believer.

As Paul said, faith is foolishness to the unbeliever. But I don't see anything foolish in it, and I respect it.

I didn't post this to mock Mormonism. I hope you know that. I've actually struggled for the last year with this. I mean, truly struggled with it. I guess I'm not a leaper type of a gal. I want to see that bridge before I take a step. :)

I think if faith brings some comfort, so be it. Faith doesn't work too well for me.

[_Ray A]

I didn't post this to mock Mormonism. I hope you know that.

I never thought that for one second. I have done my own time in rebellion and criticism, but eventually realised the folly of it all. My journey is far from over! But I respect faith, and I respect the believers.

[_charity]

And those of you who have decided to relieve your stress by leaving the Church have still not overcome the cogn dis problem. Many, many of you (maybe not all) still have a kernel of truth hiding in your souls, and you still know deep down that the Church is true. Which is why Elder Maxwell pointed out the problem you have. "You can leave the Church, but you can't leave it alone."

How do you know that, Charity? Is it possible that some of these people absolutely KNOW that the Church is false? That they absolutely believe that God is not evident and that Joseph Smith was a fraud?

If you rely on faith why can't others rely on facts?

Alfred Lord Tennyson said that nothing worth anythng can be proven.

And no, it is not possible to KNOW that the Church is false. They may not be able to see the evidences for God. But they cannot KNOW that Joseph Smith was a fraud. They would have to KNOW that Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ did not appear to him. They would have to KNOW that the object Joseph Smith had was not really a set of plates prepared by ancient prophets. There is no way to KNOW that with facts.

[_Moniker]

And those of you who have decided to relieve your stress by leaving the Church have still not overcome the cogn dis problem. Many, many of you (maybe not all) still have a kernel of truth hiding in your souls, and you still know deep down that the Church is true. Which is why Elder Maxwell pointed out the problem you have. "You can leave the Church, but you can't leave it alone."

How do you know that, Charity? Is it possible that some of these people absolutely KNOW that the Church is false? That they absolutely believe that God is not evident and that Joseph Smith was a fraud?

If you rely on faith why can't others rely on facts?

Alfred Lord Tennyson said that nothing worth anythng can be proven.

And no, it is not possible to KNOW that the Church is false.

Why not? You KNOW the Church is true? How?

They may not be able to see the evidences for God. But they cannot KNOW that Joseph Smith was a fraud. They would have to KNOW that Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ did not appear to him. They would have to KNOW that the object Joseph Smith had was not really a set of plates prepared by ancient prophets. There is no way to KNOW that with facts.

And you KNOW that Jesus came down and appeared to Joseph Smith, how precisely? What do you rely on to KNOW, Charity?