DiscussMormonism.com

Zak,

I just saw yet another one of your threads on MAD:

http://www.mormonapologetics.org/index. ... opic=32891

You really need to do some very basic reading on this subject. Scholars and critics are NOT arguing that there were NO metal tools or metallurgy prior to Columbus. We are arguing that there is no evidence of such in Mesoamerica during the Book of Mormon time period.

Yes, by the time Columbus arrived, many areas in the New World practiced metallurgy and used metal weapons.

D'oh!

Brant Gardner, bless him, just broke the news to dear Zakuska.

Brant Gardner wrote:It actually isn't very controversial that Native Americans had either metal implements or metal ornaments. They did. I have on my wall two copper "axes" that the Aztecs used as a type of currency (they are so thin that they were certainly more symbolic than functional).

The issue for the Book of Mormon isn't whether there was metal before Columbus. There was, unequivocably. The issue is when. Dates are usually post-Book of Mormon.

beastie wrote:We are arguing that there is no evidence of such in Mesoamerica during the Book of Mormon time period.[/b]

Yes, by the time Columbus arrived, many areas in the New World practiced metallurgy and used metal weapons.

D'oh!

Which is exactly what Brant Gardner pointed out on his thread.

I swear he bites on every bit of conjecture out there as his golden ticket toward proving the existence of Book of Mormon peoples.

Where he finds the time between his Loch Ness monster and black Olmecs posts, I have no idea (both of those were major "WTF" posts).

He's never found a nutjob website that he doesn't buy into. Forget about what has been found and documented by those who spend their lives learning and studying this stuff - let's find some business manager from Fresno who writes about some imaginary nation of black Olmecs.

Zak reminds me of what Martin Harris on the internet would be like.

beastie wrote:Zak reminds me of what Martin Harris on the internet would be like.

*spits morning coffee*

Zak has got to be very young. And he's showing all the young, immature tribal loyalty that we might expect from a particularly excited teenager.

I predict he will eventually leave the church.

Unless he truly is like the Martin Harris of the Internet, he must eventually grow up a bit, and I think one day he'll have a really WTF! moment and see just exactly how hard they have to stretch trying to keep up the defense of the church, and see things as they really are.

beastie wrote:Zak reminds me of what Martin Harris on the internet would be like.

My coffee did the same as Blixa's.

Thanks Beastie for the morning humor.

Beastie, isn't the argument more that there were no bronze or steel weapons? That alloys weren't known to the ancient American people?

I don't think I've heard it disputed that they worked in easily malleable ores, such as copper. Did they work in tin and nickle as well?

Sethbag wrote:Zak has got to be very young. And he's showing all the young, immature tribal loyalty that we might expect from a particularly excited teenager.

He was already a bishop when I was sixteen. Not that it's been all that long since I was sixteen, but still, I'm pretty sure there's no way Zak's a teenager.

CaliforniaKid wrote:

Sethbag wrote:Zak has got to be very young. And he's showing all the young, immature tribal loyalty that we might expect from a particularly excited teenager.

He was already a bishop when I was sixteen. Not that it's been all that long since I was sixteen, but still, I'm pretty sure there's no way Zak's a teenager.

This guy is/was a bishop?? You must be joking. Really?