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Sounds like it would have been a lot more fun to be an apostle back in 1900 than it is now.

I wonder if Talmage had a cool hookah, too?

Hey, Boaz and whoever (what kind of a handle is that?) I really dig your picture. If the chick really looked that good, I can see why he was so interested. I can't really tell if she's resisting his advances or just playing hard to get because she thinks she's supposed to.

Wheat wrote:Hey, Boaz and whoever (what kind of a handle is that?) I really dig your picture. If the chick really looked that good, I can see why he was so interested. I can't really tell if she's resisting his advances or just playing hard to get because she thinks she's supposed to.

I imagine to myself that the expression in her body language is one of inward shame and disgust over the fact that this man she looked up to as a Prophet of God, with whom she has often seen his wife Emma together in public, is about to reach his hand over to her breasts and lower that gown and start fondling her. She's been told that it's God's will, but it certainly goes against all she's ever been taught before, and she knows she's about to be deflowered, in a fit of passion, by this man who has undoubtedly done this to more than just her. If she's got any clue at all she might suspect she's one of many - perhaps even just a drop in the bucket of women to whom the Prophet has revealed this secret system to.

Anyhow, that's what I imagine is going through her mind. When Joseph whispers into her ear "and remember, this is our little secret", the words must strike her heart like acid.

Wheat wrote:Sounds like it would have been a lot more fun to be an apostle back in 1900 than it is now.

I wonder if Talmage had a cool hookah, too?

Hey, Boaz and whoever (what kind of a handle is that?) I really dig your picture. If the chick really looked that good, I can see why he was so interested. I can't really tell if she's resisting his advances or just playing hard to get because she thinks she's supposed to.

Boaz & Lidia are the super secret new names that my wife and I received during our green and white PJ party at the Mormon masonic funhouse of horrors.

Maybe her soul is racked with shame as she realizes the prophet of God is going to screw her while his wife sits at home with his young children.

Maybe she is filled with humiliation as she realizes she is being used by the prophet of God.

Maybe she is repeating a mantra, "I'm doing this to save my posterity" to get her through the humiliation.

Maybe she is wondering how she can ever live with herself knowing she has betrayed Emma.

Maybe she is wanting to cry out in sorrow at the degrading place she finds herself.

Maybe she feels honored that the prophet chose HER to screw/marry.

Maybe she is wondering how God could possibly ask her to be used in such a way.

Maybe she is just doing what she can to just get through it.

Regardless, I think it is safe to say these encounters had nothing to do with love or true intimacy.

Nothing holy or Godly about it. Like other powerful and controlling men, women were used for the few minutes of pleasure their bodies may provide. Nothing more.

~dancer~

truth dancer wrote:Maybe her soul is racked with shame as she realizes the prophet of God is going to screw her while his wife sits at home with his young children.

Nothing holy or Godly about it. Like other powerful and controlling men, women were used for the few minutes of pleasure their bodies may provide. Nothing more.

~dancer~

Thanks for the hijack TD and others. The thread was waining.

Emma wasn't just sitting at home with young children. For the last months of his pathetic life she was pregnant with their last child.

They lost most of their children.


How do you think she felt knowing that her body might fail again and this child would die as well?

How did his intercourse with her "friends" play on these fears as a fit mother and woman?

Why was her husband actively engaged in seeking intercourse with some of her closest friends - those that would be bringing her dinner, administering these and other needs within the relief society?

Who gave her comfort and affection?

My bride needed a great deal more attention with our last pregnancy. The discomfort that comes along with pregnancy (as well as the mis-carriages) was also my responsibility. I'll never quite understand what my wife went through but physical intimacy does not factor in so much as loyalty, compassion and just being there.

After so many lost children, culture of the day has little to do with his performance as a husband. Empathy and compassion lacks a credibility and consistancy when the husband is spending that strength with other women that have not been worn by time and the psychological and even physical trauma of multiple childbirths.

Regardless of whatever else he might have been to others, Emma's husband was a deadbeat.

Oh yeah, what do I care if a bishop or stake president has some pithy comment about this?

Hi Inc,

You have a powerful way of bringing words and statements into real life.

We can talk about practices and doctrine and teachings but I think it is important to try to understand how it all played out.

Who thinks it is holy or even decent for a husband to be sleeping around with other women while his wife is pregnant?

Who admires Joseph Smith for his searching out, picking up, and screwing other women while his pregnant wife is most likely needing her husband's support and care?

What woman would not feel the heart wrenching sorrow of Emma?

What decent man doesn't condemn any man who would behave in such a disgusting, despicable manner as did Joseph Smith, sleeping with other women while his pregnant wife is home caring for young children?

How anyone can rationalize or justify this astounds me. Seriously I truly find it unbelievable that anyone thinks Joseph Smith's behavior is in anyway remotely of God.

Whether God commanded him to take other men's wives, girls, and women, whether an angel with a flaming sword actually visited him or not, has NOTHING to do with Joseph Smith out and about, secretly sleeping around while his wife was pregnant, caring for small children, and most likely emotinally and physically needing her husband.


~dancer~

Thanks TD, I feel a little invisible sometimes.

This is the argument that broke the back of Mormonism for me. Pretty much everything else is superficial to me.

Whether the church is true or not is not even the issue here.

If it is really run by the one and only actual God of the universe, He stepped over the line of virtue that He drew for all of His children. This is the issue.

He called evil good and good evil.

The Mormon God cannot be trusted for consistancy of morality, virtue, compassion, empathy, loyalty, honor or even the truth. He is the first infidel.

I'd prefer to make a peaceful place in hell than to allie myself and my family with Him, His Golden Throne and white robe. The facade is nothing but a distraction to me and I place no value in it.

Will,

stuff this in your report.


rant off.

Inconceivable wrote:Thanks TD, I feel a little invisible sometimes.

You're not invisible at all. I admire your stance on the polygamy issue. It is always refreshing when a man recognizes so completely the emotional pain and heartache that polygamy had to have generated in these women.

From everything I have read in your threads and responses to others, I think you are a very sensitive, caring husband. Your wife is a lucky woman.

:)

Liz

Inconceivable wrote:Thanks TD, I feel a little invisible sometimes.

This is the argument that broke the back of Mormonism for me. Pretty much everything else is superficial to me.

Whether the church is true or not is not even the issue here.

If it is really run by the one and only actual God of the universe, He stepped over the line of virtue that He drew for all of His children. This is the issue.

He called evil good and good evil.

The Mormon God cannot be trusted for consistancy of morality, virtue, compassion, empathy, loyalty, honor or even the truth. He is the first infidel.

I'd prefer to make a peaceful place in hell than to allie myself and my family with Him, His Golden Throne and white robe. The facade is nothing but a distraction to me and I place no value in it.

Will,

stuff this in your report.


rant off.

What I find sad is that the typical response is, "Well, the God of the Old Testament did worse things, like slaughtering entire cities, including men, women, and children." Yeah, that's going to increase my desire to have faith in God!

Runtu wrote:What I find sad is that the typical response is, "Well, the God of the Old Testament did worse things, like slaughtering entire cities, including men, women, and children." Yeah, that's going to increase my desire to have faith in God!

Same God. Same throne - the only consistancy. Yesterday, today and forever.

Suffering by comparison - to Himself.

Like He would likely step down?


by the way, thanks Liz.