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Marg made a suggestion which the Mods have decided to incorporate into the Celestial Forum. If you would like to instigate a Faith Based thread, please indicate that the thread is Faith Based in the thread title.

If you indicate this, then the thread is off limits as far as the base assumptions laid out by the OP being derailed. The following perimeters immediately exist:

If the discussion involves God, then someone shouldn't come in and start arguing the existence of God. For the purpose of that thread, God exists. That's the given. (I.e....God, Buddha, whatever the higher power being discussed is).


If the thread is discussing, for example, points of LDS doctrine, then someone shouldn't come in and start challenging the validity of LDS doctrine For the purpose of that faith based thread, LDS doctrine is valid. Or Catholic doctrine is valid...or whatever type of religious doctrine is being discussed.

As the thread originator, it is your responsibility to set the guidelines for this type of thread, and place "Faith Based" as part of the thread title. This will give participants a better understanding of the desired direction of the thread.

Alternately, if you would like to declare a thread "Atheist based", you may detail the parameters of your assumptions as well. Such as, "Atheists have morals". Thus, any argument about atheists and their perceived lack of morals would be off limits in this thread.

As a Moderation Team, we hope that this will help with derailment issues, and also allow those who desire to participate in faith based discussions an "attack free" zone to do so.

liz3564 wrote:Marg made a suggestion which the Mods have decided to incorporate into the Celestial Forum. If you would like to instigate a Faith Based thread, please indicate that the thread is Faith Based in the thread title.

If you indicate this, then the thread is off limits as far as being challenged or derailed. The following perimeters immediately exist:

If the discussion involves God, then someone shouldn't come in and start arguing the existence of God. For the purpose of that thread, God exists. That's the given. (I.e....God, Buddha, whatever the higher power being discussed is).

If the thread is discussing, for example, points of LDS doctrine, then someone shouldn't come in and start challenging the validity of LDS doctrine For the purpose of that faith based thread, LDS doctrine is valid. Or Catholic doctrine is valid...or whatever type of religious doctrine is being discussed.

As the thread originator, it is your responsibility to set the guidelines for this type of thread, and place "Faith Based" as part of the thread title. This will give participants a better understanding of the desired direction of the thread.

As a Moderation Team, we hope that this will help with derailment issues, and also allow those who desire to participate in faith based discussions an "attack free" zone to do so.

This seems a bit odd to me, Liz.

I appreciate the effort to preclude derailment, but it seems like this "attack free" zone would hamstring all the participants other than the OP.

With the makeup of this board being fairly variegated, what would be the point of, say, me starting a faith-based thread about some point of evangelical Calvinism. If all the posters are to assume that evangelical Calvinism is true for the purpose of the thread, then what's to discuss?

I'd just be talking to myself. Same goes for LDS faith-based threads, or Catholic faith-based threads, or, etc.

What if I started a thread on Calvinistic predestination and an LDS poster brings in a point that challenges the "givens" of the faith-based thread? Would I say to him, "Sorry, you can't make comments like that; for the purpose of this thread, we're assuming that my views are true. Please don't challenge them again."

I thought the problem was that of rather ugly attacks that caused the thread to need to be moved to Terrestrial, rather than asserting as true beliefs that don't align with the perspective of the OP.

It seems that if those sorts of vicious responses were consistently vetted--and in the process practically discouraged--in Celestial, then the point of that kingdom would be realized: congenial discussions amongst diverse participants.

An "attack-free" zone, it seems to me, would functionally equal a discussion-free zone.

Just some thoughts.

But kudos for attempting to shape the board to fits the desires and needs of its users.

Best.

Chris

My little fish friend has captured some of my concerns as well. My main issue is the statement that:

liz3564 wrote:If the thread is discussing, for example, points of LDS doctrine, then someone shouldn't come in and start challenging the validity of LDS doctrine For the purpose of that faith based thread, LDS doctrine is valid. Or Catholic doctrine is valid...or whatever type of religious doctrine is being discussed.

Sometimes challenging the validity of the doctrine is what is necessary in a discussion about the doctrine. Otherwise people would only be allowed to post stuff like "Yeah, you're right!" and that would be it.

Excluding those of different religious viewpoints (and their respective different religious viewpoints) seems entirely too much of a shift the other way.

Discussions in the Celestial forum should remain civil and without personal attacks or invective. They shouldn't be, on their very face, limited in scope or view.

I have to agree with Chris and Skippy.

Limiting "Faith Based" threads to concurring viewpoints only seems to defeat the purpose of the board, in my opinion.

Kimberly Ann

KimberlyAnn wrote:I have to agree with Chris and Skippy.

Limiting "Faith Based" threads to concurring viewpoints only seems to defeat the purpose of the board, in my opinion.

Kimberly Ann

I don't really understand how. If you don't want a Faith Based thread, then don't create one. This is completely up to the originator of the thread.

I had received some feedback from folks that wanted this type of option, and so, after some deliberation among the Mods, we have created this option.

If no one takes advantage of it, that's fine. It doesn't change anything else that is currently happening in the Celestial Forum. It simply provides an option for those who choose to take advantage of it.

liz3564 wrote:

KimberlyAnn wrote:I have to agree with Chris and Skippy.

Limiting "Faith Based" threads to concurring viewpoints only seems to defeat the purpose of the board, in my opinion.

Kimberly Ann

I don't really understand how. If you don't want a Faith Based thread, then don't create one. This is completely up to the originator of the thread.

I had received some feedback from folks that wanted this type of option, and so, after some deliberation among the Mods, we have created this option.

If no one takes advantage of it, that's fine. It doesn't change anything else that is currently happening in the Celestial Forum. It simply provides an option for those who choose to take advantage of it.

I guess perhaps, then, I can boycott both boards without losing much sleep over either. Was that ever the purpose of MDB?

Yes, it's totally weird to find this proviso here.

Good night to all.

Chris

cksalmon wrote:Yes, it's totally weird to find this proviso here.

I'm still agreeing with Chris on this one. It would be like watching my 5 year old inventing elaborate and overly specific rules on the playground, that eventually squashes all of the interest out of the game resulting in the other kids slowly dropping out of the game.

And it does seem totally antithetical to the purpose of this board, whether in or out of the Celestial forum.

This is a bad precedent and I suggest this new rule be removed.

The children who are unable to defend their belief in the indefensible should be challenged and rightfully so. Not because their beliefs are wrong but because those who disagree with them have a voice in ANY thread. Excluding individuals in faith based threads pigeonholes discussion and creates "discussion ghettos".

This is a bad move guys. Remove the rule. If anyone balks at the removal then they will not be missed, at least by me.

YOU CAN NOT PLEASE EVERYONE

liz3564 wrote:

KimberlyAnn wrote:I have to agree with Chris and Skippy.

Limiting "Faith Based" threads to concurring viewpoints only seems to defeat the purpose of the board, in my opinion.

Kimberly Ann

I don't really understand how. If you don't want a Faith Based thread, then don't create one. This is completely up to the originator of the thread.

I had received some feedback from folks that wanted this type of option, and so, after some deliberation among the Mods, we have created this option.

If no one takes advantage of it, that's fine. It doesn't change anything else that is currently happening in the Celestial Forum. It simply provides an option for those who choose to take advantage of it.

So let me get this straight Liz, someone creates a "faith-based" thread and I want to participate via shooting down a central point of the posit forwrded by the Jesus/mohammed/elohim freak. At that point I am not allowed to challenge new ideas. BAD. very bad.

Shame on those who support this rule and shame on the dips***s who proposed it in the first place.

Mercury wrote:So let me get this straight Liz, someone creates a "faith-based" thread and I want to participate via shooting down a central point of the posit forwrded by the Jesus/mohammed/elohim freak. At that point I am not allowed to challenge new ideas.

Allow me to clarify: Opposing views are just as allowable now as they ever were. The only difference is that a thread starter may now set down certain parameters for his/her own thread.

In other words, if someone posts his or her testimony of Christ or the divine calling of Joseph Smith, you can't challenge that testimony in the thread itself. You are perfectly free to challenge everything he or she said, but you'll merely have to start a new thread about it in the Terrestrial Forum is all. Title it something like, "Challenge to ___'s testimony in the Celestial Forum" or something like that.

So you're still free to say whatever you want. Thread starters in the Celestial Forum are simply allowed a little more leeway to determine the venue is all.