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I watched a trailer of National Geo's Sunday night program of North America's indulgence of excesses. Summary, if the other 95% of the world consummed as we do, it would require five earths to provide the the resources.

It appears to me that Christianism specifically must be held accountable for a great degree of this over indulgence in, and utter waste of, earth's produce.

IF theologians and ecclesiasts of any stripe, in the hundreds of Christian sects, paid any attention to the significant truths expressed in the Bible that pertain to THIS life, humanity would not be faced with the severe circumstances that threaten our future. That Christian churches in general preached incessantly the Fall, Redemption and Heaven Existance, while ignoring the anti-materialistic teachings of their so-called Saviour, is a flagrant abuse of power and influence.

Any serious contemplation of (Mat.6:24-34) cannot help but establish a norm that directly conflicts with what is considered normal in the disparate society we have been duped into believing is OK with "God". How often has anyone heard the parable spoken of that suggested the rich-man give it all away, and serve humanity? If so where? How often?

"IF" there ever was a Prophet of "God" since the murder of Jesus, especially in these "latter days", with "eyes to see and ears to hear," he/she surely would have attempted to restrain wealth-building, and lead his/her people to understand what Jesus said about materialism, personal worth, aggrandizement, caring, sharing and cooperating. Not one Jesus word encouraging competition, discrimination, or war...

I think the National Geographic program will be a thought provoker. Unfortunately it might conflict with the History Channel's second part on the life of Castro. Now there is a real Seer who truly saw the plight of his people, and did something! I'll just switch back & forth & get 'em both... Warm regards, Roger

Roger Morrison wrote:I watched a trailer of National Geo's Sunday night program of North America's indulgence of excesses. Summary, if the other 95% of the world consummed as we do, it would require five earths to provide the the resources.

It appears to me that Christianism specifically must be held accountable for a great degree of this over indulgence in, and utter waste of, earth's produce.

IF theologians and ecclesiasts of any stripe, in the hundreds of Christian sects, paid any attention to the significant truths expressed in the Bible that pertain to THIS life, humanity would not be faced with the severe circumstances that threaten our future. That Christian churches in general preached incessantly the Fall, Redemption and Heaven Existance, while ignoring the anti-materialistic teachings of their so-called Saviour, is a flagrant abuse of power and influence.

Any serious contemplation of (Mat.6:24-34) cannot help but establish a norm that directly conflicts with what is considered normal in the disparate society we have been duped into believing is OK with "God". How often has anyone heard the parable spoken of that suggested the rich-man give it all away, and serve humanity? If so where? How often?

"IF" there ever was a Prophet of "God" since the murder of Jesus, especially in these "latter days", with "eyes to see and ears to hear," he/she surely would have attempted to restrain wealth-building, and lead his/her people to understand what Jesus said about materialism, personal worth, aggrandizement, caring, sharing and cooperating. Not one Jesus word encouraging competition, discrimination, or war...

I think the National Geographic program will be a thought provoker. Unfortunately it might conflict with the History Channel's second part on the life of Castro. Now there is a real Seer who truly saw the plight of his people, and did something! I'll just switch back & forth & get 'em both... Warm regards, Roger

the truth of the matter is, when we don't have, we want, when we get, we want more. I'm not sure you can pin that on Christianity. A vast amount of the world's riches is held by a small number of families, all of which are Muslim.

Roger, would it be better if the Christian Churches embraced the Four Noble Truths, especially that desire is the root of all suffering?

Harmony wrote:

the truth of the matter is, when we don't have, we want, when we get, we want more. I'm not sure you can pin that on Christianity. A vast amount of the world's riches is held by a small number of families, all of which are Muslim.

Seems to be the way we were conditioned/indoctrinated to be so. "Monkey see, monkey do." I pin a great deal of "that on Christianity" as it was modeled by the influence of Rome, and the Nobilities that followed and picked-up on the "Divine right of Kings" et al. The creeds that dazzled the simple minds of the times well served their intended purposes. Seems they still effect today's simpletons... But there are fewer per capita i think?? That could mean there are more poor too, right?

"...all of which are Muslim." Are you sure Harmony?

Just Googled, and only traced the list to 50... Sufficient to make a point...
Findings: 25 of the first 50, from USA.
1&2 Gates & Buffet, USA. (Think i read recently, they reversed positions. Poor Billy)
3. Albrecht, Germany.
The next 7 were from USA

Nine of that ten are Christian influenced i would think?? Probably all attend church. (I am aware of their good works. Not the point.) Not a Musslim among 'em :-) OTOH, i was surprised to find, in another reading, not too long ago, the # of super rich in India, and Mexico. Nothing like in the USA where THE Waltons (remember John-Boy :-) out number any other clan.

I do not lay "blame" on individual wealthies, but on the culture that encourages greed and exploitation. Particulary since that culture boasts its Christian Heritage. Little wonder that the Fundies, of all ilks, do not list in their criteria of what makes a Christian any thing that suggests anti-materialism, as Jesus taught it by precept and parable. Not a TR question either. Except the monetary one, "Are you paid up to THE Church?"

Really, how long before this Christian Charade is uncovered like Warren Jeff's scam...

Gotta be something wrong with our roots folks. Cuz whatever good fruits we're getting are coming more from science and secular trees than from Theologial, Divinity, and/or Melchizedek orchards. In my seriously considered opinion. Check Google to confirm. Warm regards, Roger

Roger Morrison wrote:Harmony wrote:

the truth of the matter is, when we don't have, we want, when we get, we want more. I'm not sure you can pin that on Christianity. A vast amount of the world's riches is held by a small number of families, all of which are Muslim.

Seems to be the way we were conditioned/indoctrinated to be so. "Monkey see, monkey do." I pin a great deal of "that on Christianity" as it was modeled by the influence of Rome, and the Nobilities that followed and picked-up on the "Divine right of Kings" et al. The creeds that dazzled the simple minds of the times well served their intended purposes. Seems they still effect today's simpletons... But there are fewer per capita I think?? That could mean there are more poor too, right?

"...all of which are Muslim." Are you sure Harmony?

Just Googled, and only traced the list to 50... Sufficient to make a point...
Findings: 25 of the first 50, from USA.
1&2 Gates & Buffet, USA. (Think I read recently, they reversed positions. Poor Billy)
3. Albrecht, Germany.
The next 7 were from USA

I didn't say "all", I said "a vast amount". And I was thinking of the Arabic world, where bathroom fixtures are made of gold.

I'm not saying Christians aren't responsible. I'm saying Christians aren't the only ones responsible. And Christians are only 2000 years old. Then we can start blaming the Jews and the Muslims.

moksha wrote:Roger, would it be better if the Christian Churches embraced the Four Noble Truths, especially that desire is the root of all suffering?

Hi moksha. You give me too much credit. "The Four Noble Truths" are burried too deep in my memory vault to instantly recall. (Getting harder to pry open the door by the minute :-) Please list them for me. However, that You bring them to the table, i'm most likely to agree.
OTOH, "...desire is the root of all suffering..."?? That sounds intriguing?? Warm regards, Roger

Roger

Good food for thought. I am often troubled by this though I am guilty of North American Excesses. While I am charitable for many causes I still consume more than my fair share. So what to do. Gates and Buffet are two good example of giving away their wealth. I admire then for it. I have personal plans on what to do with my small but growing net worth but most of it will be at or close to my death. I can tell you it will not all go to my kids. But in the journey the question becomes what kind of car should I drive or home should I own. How many more cruise trip vacations should I really take?

Harmony said:

I didn't say "all", I said "a vast amount". And I was thinking of the Arabic world, where bathroom fixtures are made of gold.

I'm not saying Christians aren't responsible. I'm saying Christians aren't the only ones responsible. And Christians are only 2000 years old. Then we can start blaming the Jews and the Muslims.

Sorry for my interpretation of "vast amount". The Dubai UAE, pop aprox 2.5mil. where the wealth is, makes up a miniscule piece of the Arab world. And is not a great oil producer. (6% of 37bill gross that comes primarily from other super-richies. Tiger Woods has a freebie Condo just for showing up occasionally to be seen on a golf course.) Do you think "gold bathroom fixture" are none existant in America?

Never too late to trace corruptions. But that isn't as important as acknowledging that they exist, and that they are in conflict with the real core of Jesus' teachings, and remedy them. Jesus' teachings that have little, if anything, to do with what has suckered in the 2.5 billion world-wide who are classed as Christian in a mass of 6.5 billion +/-. Most of whom struggle to eat while American gluttony is next to pandemic... Isn't cyber-media amazing!? Me thinks i'm getting a whiff of apologetics here?? ;-) Warm regards, Roger

Roger, the Buddha (if he were speaking in Christian terms) was basically saying that passion, ardour, pursuit of wealth, material possessions and prestige, striving for fame and popularity are all transient things, that keep us from realizing our true nature and our link with the divine.

moksha wrote:Roger, the Buddha (if he were speaking in Christian terms) was basically saying that passion, ardour, pursuit of wealth, material possessions and prestige, striving for fame and popularity are all transient things, that keep us from realizing our true nature and our link with the divine.

Yes, i agree. As i profile Jesus, and interpret HIS teachings (not those of Sectarian Theologian's) he taught the same philosophy. Thanks mok, Roger