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Interracial marriage still discouraged in the church?
Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2008 7:01 pm
by _SatanWasSetUp
I notice a reference to one of Spencer Kimball's talks discouraging interracial marriage is still in the current Aaronic Priesthood manual.
Here's a section from Aaronic Priesthood Manual 3: Lesson 31, Choosing an Eternal Companion.
What characteristics of young women are socially and spiritually appealing to you?
Write the young men’s answers on the chalkboard, such as—
1. Is unselfish.
2. Shows respect for me.
3. Has initiative.
4. Is considerate of others.
5. Shows patience in stressful situations.
6. Is an active Church member.
7. Has a testimony of the gospel and obeys the commandments.
8. Maintains a healthy outlook toward life.
9. Possesses values and goals similar to mine.
Ask each young man to select what he thinks are the three most important attributes on the chalkboard. Take a vote to determine which areas the young men consider most important. Discuss why they voted the way they did.
Quotation and discussion
Compare the results of the vote with the following statement by President Spencer W. Kimball. Have a young man read it.
“We recommend that people marry those who are of the same racial background generally, and of somewhat the same economic and social and educational background (some of those are not an absolute necessity, but preferred), and above all, the same religious background, without question” (“Marriage and Divorce,” in 1976 Devotional Speeches of the Year [Provo: Brigham Young University Press, 1977], p. 144).
Interesting that this same quote is not in the Young Women's Manual in the chapter "Preparing to Become and Eternal Companion." I think this was missed by the correlation committee. It seems to me that in this day and age the people making the manuals would be scrubbing these old outdated teachings and opinions from old prophets from the lesson manuals. It's not in the YW manual, and I would bet that it was supposed to be removed from the YM manual and someone missed it.
Re: Interracial marriage still discouraged in the church?
Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2008 7:21 pm
by _cinepro
What's weird is that the list of nine items doesn't have a line saying "Is the same race as me". The topic isn't introduced until the quote by President Kimball.
Re: Interracial marriage still discouraged in the church?
Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2008 9:05 pm
by _The Nehor
Newsflash: LDS leader suggests that couples with similar backgrounds may have a better chance of a successful marriage.
What a monster......
Re: Interracial marriage still discouraged in the church?
Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2008 9:16 pm
by _moksha
The Nehor wrote:Newsflash: LDS leader suggests that couples with similar backgrounds may have a better chance of a successful marriage.
That is right, they wish for couples that can be evenly yolked. That is why they have never opposed marriages to giant ground sloths for BYU males. Also, wealthy young Mormon males are permitted to cross the tracks when it comes to trophy wives.
Re: Interracial marriage still discouraged in the church?
Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2008 9:24 pm
by _The Nehor
moksha wrote:The Nehor wrote:Newsflash: LDS leader suggests that couples with similar backgrounds may have a better chance of a successful marriage.
That is right, they wish for couples that can be evenly yolked. That is why they have never opposed marriages to giant ground sloths for BYU males. Also, wealthy young Mormon males are permitted to cross the tracks when it comes to trophy wives.
For the former, the church's stance on bestiality is well known. Giant sloth male BYU students are most likely to have successful marriages with giant sloth female BYU students. Of course they're permitted to marry anyone they want. Just like the trophy wives. It's just not considered to be the best formula for a successful marriage.
Re: Interracial marriage still discouraged in the church?
Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2008 9:36 pm
by _Ray A
I don't see this advice as being in harmony with Acts 17:
22 Then Paul stood in the midst of Mars’ hill, and said, Ye men of Athens, I perceive that in all things ye are too superstitious.
23 For as I passed by, and beheld your devotions, I found an altar with this inscription, TO THE UNKNOWN GOD. Whom therefore ye ignorantly worship, him declare I unto you.
24 God that made the world and all things therein, seeing that he is Lord of heaven and earth, dwelleth not in temples made with hands;
25 Neither is worshipped with men’s hands, as though he needed any thing, seeing he giveth to all life, and breath, and all things;
26 And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation;
27 That they should seek the Lord, if haply they might feel after him, and find him, though he be not far from every one of us:
28 For in him we live, and move, and have our being; as certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring.
29 Forasmuch then as we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Godhead is like unto gold, or silver, or stone, graven by art and man’s device.
30 And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:
Nor the Book of Mormon, 2 Ne. 26:33:
33 For none of these iniquities come of the Lord; for he doeth that which is good among the children of men; and he doeth nothing save it be plain unto the children of men; and he inviteth them all to come unto him and partake of his goodness; and he denieth none that come unto him, black and white, bond and free, male and female; and he remembereth the heathen; and all are alike unto God, both Jew and Gentile.
What the does "racial background" have to do with this?
Re: Interracial marriage still discouraged in the church?
Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2008 11:52 pm
by _SatanWasSetUp
The Nehor wrote:Newsflash: LDS leader suggests that couples with similar backgrounds may have a better chance of a successful marriage.
What a monster......
No, the standard teaching now is any 2 worthy people can have a successful marriage, and this was actually a quote from the same Spencer W. Kimball later in the same lesson.
As a part of the discussion, you might assign two different young men to read the following quotations, the first by President Kimball and the other by Elder Boyd K. Packer:
“ ‘Soul mates’ are a fiction and an illusion; and while every young man and young woman will seek with all diligence and prayerfulness to find a mate with whom life can be most compatible and beautiful, yet it is certain that almost any good man and any good woman can have happiness and a successful marriage if both are willing to pay the price” (“Marriage and Divorce,” p. 146).
This is what I believe is taught these days. Any faithful latter-day saint man and woman can have a successful marriage. This is why I believe the first quote from Kimball is outdated and no longer taught, and I think the correlation committee missed it when updating the manual.
It is a pre-1978 teaching and seems out of place with current LDS teachings.
Re: Interracial marriage still discouraged in the church?
Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2008 11:59 pm
by _Daniel Peterson
I've heard no counsel against interracial marriages for many years -- probably since President Kimball's statement -- and have myself enthusiastically helped to send at least a pair of interracial couples to the temple.
That said, I don't think it's unwise to call people's attention to the fact that there are many, many factors that can cause friction in a marriage -- some marriages, believe it or not, actually fail -- and that cultural differences (which may or may not flow from racial differences) can easily be among them, along with resistance from one or both of the couple's respective ethnic groups, problems facing children of mixed-race, etc. It's not wrong to remind people of human nature, however much we may regret some of its manifestations.
Re: Interracial marriage still discouraged in the church?
Posted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 12:00 am
by _Ray A
Elder Boyd K. Packer:
“ ‘Soul mates’ are a fiction and an illusion;
And masturbation leads to homosexuality.
Re: Interracial marriage still discouraged in the church?
Posted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 2:09 pm
by _Inconceivable
Daniel Peterson wrote:I've heard no counsel against interracial marriages for many years --
..although you just
read it from an Aaronic priesthood manual just a few moments ago - approved by Mormons that have more authority in their little pinkies than you've got in your whole body.
28 O that cunning plan of the evil one! O the vainness, and the frailties, and the foolishness of men!
When they are learned they think they are wise, and they hearken not unto the counsel of God, for they set it aside, supposing they know of themselves, wherefore, their wisdom is foolishness and it profiteth them not. And they shall perish.(Book of Mormon | 2 Nephi 9:28)
Professor, do you need a little help steadying your Rameumptum?