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The Church has been hit pretty hard in the national news all week for the Chad Hardy/BYU (the yanking of his diploma) and Prop 8 stuff but no response from the newsroom when it usually acts pretty quickly.

Thoughts?

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mms wrote:Thoughts?

Not likely.

But they're not completely impossible.

We'll see.

Daniel provides his normal contribution.

My reaction is that perhaps they are saying nothing on it because there is little that they can say that will make sense to outsiders.

And Hardy says he will sue for his diploma, so they may have been told by "legal" to not comment. I noticed that at least one law firm has offered publicly to take up Hardy's cause and Hardy claims to be "interviewing" attorneys for the gig and has started a legal fund.

I think this Hardy thing was really a poor maneuver by the powers that be. He had already finished all requirenebts and it seems a little vindictive. I wont be surprised if the Church ultimately caves to public/legal pressure and gives him the diploma.

beastie wrote:Daniel provides his normal contribution.

Beastie posts her recurrent whine.

mms wrote:And Hardy says he will sue for his diploma, so they may have been told by "legal" to not comment. I noticed that at least one law firm has offered publicly to take up Hardy's cause and Hardy claims to be "interviewing" attorneys for the gig and has started a legal fund.

I think this Hardy thing was really a poor maneuver by the powers that be. He had already finished all requirenebts and it seems a little vindictive. I wont be surprised if the Church ultimately caves to public/legal pressure and gives him the diploma.

Daniel---I'm curious as to your thoughts on this. As a member of BYU Faculty....Do you think they should have denied Hardy his diploma?

Frankly, I don't know what kind of legal leg Hardy has to stand on. Maybe Skippy or Bob can weigh in on this. Basically, BYU is a private university, and it states in its' policy that it can withhold a diploma based on excommunication from the Church.

It sucks, and I don't agree with the policy, but it is stated. Therefore, I think that legally, BYU is in a pretty decent place. I'm no expert on the law, though.

Well, one thing about the law is that if it allows even a sliver of a colorable argument, the result can be years of litigation and hundreds of thousands of dollars in fees as well as the publicity that goes along with it. Here, I suspect that the argument will have something to do with federal funding issues as well as the technical language of the policy (i.e. honor code), etc.

I have no argument with BYU kicking people out when it wants to (even if this right is applied arbitrarily, which it has to be because the Spirit dictates different degrees of discipline for the same conduct depending on the particular authority imposing the discipline) but, here, when he had completed all requirements prior to excommunication, it truly seems like little more than a "gotcha". It seems that these "gotchas" rarely work out to the benefit of the person/entity purportedly "getting" the other.

liz3564 wrote:Daniel---I'm curious as to your thoughts on this. As a member of BYU Faculty....Do you think they should have denied Hardy his diploma?

Frankly, I don't know what kind of legal leg Hardy has to stand on. Maybe Skippy or Bob can weigh in on this. Basically, BYU is a private university, and it states in its' policy that it can withhold a diploma based on excommunication from the Church.

It sucks, and I don't agree with the policy, but it is stated. Therefore, I think that legally, BYU is in a pretty decent place. I'm no expert on the law, though.

I haven't really paid much attention to the case, and I don't know the details.

I do, however strongly support BYU's right and obligation to dismiss students who leave the Church or who fundamentally fail to comply with BYU standards.

Whether this case will prove to be a public relations setback even if within the rules (if it's within the rules), I don't know. I realize that some here and over on the so-called "Recovery" board are calling it a PR debacle (and gleefully predicting a lot of negative fallout), but I'm not sure that's true. I don't believe that I've heard anybody at BYU, student or faculty, so much as mention the case. I don't have my ear close to the ground there these days, as I'm busy with certain other things, so I may be mistaken, but it doesn't seem to be garnering much attention, so far as I can tell.

Daniel Peterson wrote:Whether this case will prove to be a public relations setback even if within the rules (if it's within the rules), I don't know. I realize that some here and over on the so-called "Recovery" board are calling it a PR debacle (and gleefully predicting a lot of negative fallout), but I'm not sure that's true. I don't believe that I've heard anybody at BYU, student or faculty, so much as mention the case. I don't have my ear close to the ground there these days, as I'm busy with certain other things, so I may be mistaken, but it doesn't seem to be garnering much attention, so far as I can tell.

so you are using the reaction AT BYU as a measure of the PR effect? That's not at all where I would look. what do you make of it being picked up and reported all across the nation? good PR?

Thoughts?

Damn the torpedoes and hit 'em hard where it counts. Revelation 3:16