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The "Anti-Mormon" Bushman Challenge

Posted: Wed Feb 25, 2009 4:36 am
by _Gadianton
I sit before my computer today weary and tired. As I peer down at the hands moving across the face of my pocket watch, I'm reminded that I just don't have time to follow up on all those little things I'd like to in life, so I come before you all today, humbled, seeking your help.

I had the thought that maybe I've been wrong about the L-Skinnyesque Trojan Horse usage of the word "Anti-Mormon". So I'm going to allow the testimony of an expert witness weigh heavy on my considerations. Prior to seeking an expert witness, I had explored some online materials which, quite frankly, only added credibility to my suspicions about the apologists. For instance, I consulted Wikipedia:

Wiki wrote:Today, the term [anti-Mormon] is primarily used as a descriptor for persons and publications that oppose The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, although its precise scope has been the subject of some debate. It is used by some to describe anything perceived as critical of the LDS Church,[5] whereas others reserve it for critical persons or publications who enlist dishonest or inflammatory rhetoric.[6]


My first reaction was that maybe I am wrong, maybe it is very common for the term to describe "anything critical" of the church without implying dishonesty or inlammatory rhetoric. But when I followed the footnote, expecting to find some scholarly source material, I am led to none other than SHIELDS and FAIR, and particularily the "L-Gang up" on James White and Migdley's definitions! Yes, I admit, I was triumphant at that moment.

But, I hate to take my victories so easily. I felt -- since I have virtually no competition from the apologists -- I must try harder to falsify my views.

Since clearly, FAIR and SHIELDS are the worst sources one could look to for TBMs to define "anti-Mormon" in an objective way, it came to my mind that given the relative praise of Richard Bushman from both TBM and critic alike, that I should take great interest in the way he uses the word in "Rough Stone Rolling".

Back to the issue of time, I just don't have it to pursue this myself right now. So any of you who have read Bushmnan's book, please feel free to chime in and enlighten me on how Richard Bushman uses the term "anti-Mormon".

Thank you.

Re: The "Anti-Mormon" Challenge - A scholarly request

Posted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 12:17 am
by _Gadianton
Wow, what a derailment huh? Moderators, could I trouble you to split every single post on this thread off onto another thread since it's all off topic? I'd like my scholarly request to remain, but without the noise.

Re: The "Anti-Mormon" Challenge - A scholarly request

Posted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 1:19 am
by _Yoda
Gadianton wrote:Wow, what a derailment huh? Moderators, could I trouble you to split every single post on this thread off onto another thread since it's all off topic? I'd like my scholarly request to remain, but without the noise.

(Moderator Note) Topic split per thread starter's request. Other comments can be found here:

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=8614&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=21

Re: The "Anti-Mormon" Bushman Challenge

Posted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 5:47 pm
by _Mister Scratch
A very provocative and fair-minded challenge, Dr. Robbers. It seems to me that the import of your request far surpasses Bill Hamblin's stupid and mean-spirited Book of Mormon "challenges." You really ought to be given an award for your work.

Re: The "Anti-Mormon" Bushman Challenge

Posted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 7:24 pm
by _Daniel Peterson
Mister Scratch wrote:A very provocative and fair-minded challenge, Dr. Robbers. . . . You really ought to be given an award for your work.

Mister Scratch endorses Gadianton Scratch.

Check.

Mister Scratch wrote:It seems to me that the import of your request far surpasses Bill Hamblin's stupid and mean-spirited Book of Mormon "challenges."

"Mean-spirited."

The identity of Mister Scratch has been authenticated. This is a genuine message from Mister Scratch.

Re: The "Anti-Mormon" Bushman Challenge

Posted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 11:42 pm
by _Gadianton
Mister Scratch wrote:A very provocative and fair-minded challenge, Dr. Robbers. It seems to me that the import of your request far surpasses Bill Hamblin's stupid and mean-spirited Book of Mormon "challenges." You really ought to be given an award for your work.


Thanks Mister Scratch! It means a lot to me coming from someone who doesn't give out his praise easily. I'm happy to go without an award beyond knowing that I've contributed to fair-minded dialogue.

Notice that none of the apologists have chimed in to claim an easy victory. I have not read Bushman's book. So I'm really taking a huge chance here, the apologists could easily embarrass me and prove me wrong. I suppose, the only reason I'm not afraid of that, is my love of truth, and I'd rather be wrong and know the truth than think I'm right in ignorance.

Re: The "Anti-Mormon" Bushman Challenge

Posted: Fri Feb 27, 2009 1:03 am
by _Daniel Peterson
Gadianton wrote:Thanks Mister Scratch! It means a lot to me coming from someone who doesn't give out his praise easily. I'm happy to go without an award beyond knowing that I've contributed to fair-minded dialogue. . . . I suppose, the only reason I'm not afraid of that, is my love of truth, and I'd rather be wrong and know the truth than think I'm right in ignorance.

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