Anyone offer a little advice?

[_mms]

So I have been around a while and mostly lurk but I have had my moments of involvement here. The short story is that it has been quite a while now (couple of years) since I first started down the road of doubt. I know this will disappoint some, but it was not because I wanted to sin, but because I read RSR and saw a different Joseph Smith than the one I had known through currciculum materials. So I then read FARMS/FAIR stuff and was struck by the number of things that the apologists admitted to be true. Like many others, I spent hours and hours and hours and then more hours devouring all that I could. Some things made me very angry, I must admit. In fact, I am still disturbed by the Church's failure to be forthcoming about so many things (in the current Joseph Smith manual, on the Joseph Smith website, etc.).

I know it is hard for the apologist/TBM mind to believe this, but this is the very last thing I wanted for myself--to conclude that people are LDS not because it is the only true and living church upon the face of the whole earth, but because they want it to be true or because their parents insist that they believe its true or because the pressures surrounding them are so great that they simply have no choice but to believe it's true. I cannot stop thinking about it; it nearly consumes me. So I look again at everything I spent so much time looking at before, in hopes that I will find something to salvage my testimony. But I simply become more convinced and start to wonder how anyone who has truly looked at this stuff objectively (as objectively as possible) without the need to draw a certain conclusion can possibly have a "feeling" overcome the evidence.

I do not want to change anything about my life. I do not want to drink, cheat on my spouse, take up golf on sundays, or do anything differently than I did before I traveled down this road. I want my relationships to be the way the were before I learned what I know, as it seems that some within my close circle no longer trust me or value what I have to say about anything because they believe I have lost my way with regard to the most important thing. I want to think about other things, talk about other things, get rid of my anger and find some "good" to hang on to since I seem to no longer be able to hold on to the "Mormon" good. I want to forgive those who are so quick to make assumptions about why I am where I am.

But I am struggling. (by the way, Still going to Church--sit in the back and try not to be bothered by how little people seem to know about their church, remembering that I was there.)

[_beastie]

I could have written those exact words back in 1993.

It's not an easy journey. Believers who imagine doubters/exbelievers have taken some easy way out, that we really wanted to not believe all along, are delusional. It was one of the most painful experiences of my life.

[_JohnStuartMill]

Follow your conscience. Remember that the people who judge you are wrong to do so. Never let anyone do your thinking for you.

You seem pretty thoughtful about all this, and less bitter than most people who leave the Church. I'm sure it'll work out fine. Good luck.

[_John Larsen]

I have been there to. One day it occurred to me, "why am I in such a hurry?" It probably started because of a thirst to know more and more of Mormon history, to digest as much as a possible could. But then it occurred to me, I will take things as they come and I don't have to do anything I don't want to do.

I know some ex-Mormons want to dive into everything, and a few have run into problems. Most just grow out of it rather quickly. I took everything very slowly and just did things when they felt right. And I am not talking about breaking the WOW or sex. I am talking about allowing yourself to think and feel things you weren't allowed before. Things like, I like this part of the Bible but not that part. Just allowing your mind to draw natural conclusions.

In short, I gave myself permission to just go with flow. I had given up a belief in God about 4 years before I took a drink. Today, I don't drink very much at all. I only took off my garments when it felt right. I don't smoke. I don't cheat on my wife (well, except for the obligatory internet porn--but that was before too ;) ). I really don't behave much differently. In fact, I swear much less now. I guess I have nothing to prove.

The best thing to do is focus in on your relationships and build those. I think my life has been better because the time and energy that I used to give to the Church I now give to my wife and children, so our relationship has changed, but for the better. It is always a little rocky because you have to redefine the rules some what, and you have to come up with good reasons. You can't tell your kids to do something because it will make Jesus cry and you can't play the priesthood card. But we are much better today.

The best advice that I can give is that it gets better. There are some dark nights but one day you will wake up and discover that everything is better. If not, you can always go back. They will take you back and you will be a kind of celebrity. Win win, eh?

[_Phouchg]

Of anybody I should have had the easiest time leaving the church. I was baptized as an adult, have no family members in the church, have disbelieved the truth claims and theology of the church for nearly the entire time I was in it, and have always been the atypical church member. Resigning should have been a cakewalk for me, right?

Wrong. This was a surprisingly difficult period of my life. I think the fact that my wife is still a faithful member and seeing what she has felt over the past couple of months has made me realize that choices like these don't come lightly. And I am married to the best woman in the world, because even though she doesn't agree with my choice, she still loves me exactly for who I am.

I have no regrets about my choice. But sometimes I do wonder "what if I stayed"?

That is why I can never "leave the church alone" even though I have left the church.

fook

[_Yong Xi]

Many of us have experienced exactly what you are going through. It is very difficult. Good luck.

Ten years later and I still have never touched alcohol, tobacco/drugs or even tasted coffee/tea. Nor have I ever cheated on my wife. I am more Mormon than most Mormons. My only advice, however, would be to reconsider Sunday golf.

[_msnobody]

Yes, my thoughts are random....

When I read topics such as this, it always reminds me of the stages of grief. Really, I think it is a grieving process with the stages of grief sometimes overlapping.

I've heard it said that the church takes advantage of one's emotions and needs.

There is great satisfation in doing what is right, good, or to try to be the best one can be. It is so much better though to work to be a good father or mother, etc. for example, because you want to instead of you have to.

Now on to my evangelicalness....
There is the promise of living eternally with Heavenly Father without having to obtain his favor by our own merit [Jesus the proptitiation for our sin]. We can be blessed right now with every spiritual blessing. While it is an individual thing, there is still the possibility of living eternally with those we love. We still have marriage. One can find community outside of Mormonism.

Like someone said above, I think, it is okay to take things slowly. You're gonna be okay mm, just give it time.

[_Ray A]

Leaving the Church (in 1987) wasn’t the most painful period of my life, the last few years in the Church was close, though. From 1985 on I was classed as a heretic, and I have one fine memory of a self-righteous brother telling me I was a “Korihor” and “faith-destroyer”. Another confronted me in the street and called me a “Darwinist” (which was way too generous). After several years of members displaying William-like behaviour towards me, I decided it was time to take a walk in the other direction. I believe now it was a mistake to later continue to view Mormonism as “true in some way”, but the Book of Mormon continued, for a long time, to be my last bastion of some kind of hope. That was unceremoniously 100% shattered some two years ago (from the historical perspective). Even reading the MAD board today I have a different perspective than I did two years ago. Perhaps I was like why me then, hanging on to emotion more than reason.

Time is the only thing heals or changes, and it can heal or change anything.

I know this will disappoint some, but it was not because I wanted to sin, but because I read RSR and saw a different Joseph Smith than the one I had known through currciculum materials. So I then read FARMS/FAIR stuff and was struck by the number of things that the apologists admitted to be true. Like many others, I spent hours and hours and hours and then more hours devouring all that I could. Some things made me very angry, I must admit. In fact, I am still disturbed by the Church's failure to be forthcoming about so many things (in the current Joseph Smith manual, on the Joseph Smith website, etc.).

They still haven’t got the message, and unlikely ever will. These days I just tell them I like sinning, it’s far more enjoyable. Resistance is futile.

So I look again at everything I spent so much time looking at before, in hopes that I will find something to salvage my testimony. But I simply become more convinced and start to wonder how anyone who has truly looked at this stuff objectively (as objectively as possible) without the need to draw a certain conclusion can possibly have a "feeling" overcome the evidence.

Precisely my position for a long time. See above. For me that journey has ended. It (Mormonism) not only doesn’t look “possibly true” now, but even ridiculous.

I want to forgive those who are so quick to make assumptions about why I am where I am.

That’s a lifetime pursuit. People will always make wrong assumptions about you, and not just Mormons. Life is a journey, and we will keep learning and gaining new and different perspectives until the day we die.

[_mms]

I appreciate all of the responses and would love to see more. I have read and re-read them and will again. The experiences shared I know came at a significant price, which makes me appreciate them that much more. I realize everyone has his/her own journey and each will likely be similar in some ways and not-so-similar in others.

The response I get from some of my closest LDS friends is one of fear. The fear is so readily apparent with some of them--palpable even. That fear leads them to shut down and wish they never asked me what troubled me about the Church. They like to believe they can handle a discussion without feeling any differently about me or about the Church, and they want to because they are my friends and want to be there for me, but it becomes clear in minutes that they cannot handle even the mildest discussion of troubling issues.

That's what makes getting input from those who have been through this so extremely valuable and comforting. It's a weird sort of loneliness--this process. I don't need anyone to agree with my conclusions about the history or the truth claims of the Church, I just long for a little understanding--or a true desire to understand--and that has been missing in a very big way. But part of that is my fault as I try to protect others from what I have learned and put on a big smile and a firm handshake on Sunday when I am really looking around feeling so many emotions--sadness, anger, insecurity, annoyance, heartbreak, concern, etc.

[_huckelberry]

experiences will vary considerably, if I should make a suggestion you should view the suggestion with some . caution. I left at age 17. Though I had in previous years expected to go on a mission, I decided it was out of the question. Upon starting college I quit making any sort of appearance in church. I have not attented an LDS church service since 1967. I have had occasion to return to my childhood ward building for a few funerals. The occasions left me with no desire to return on Sunday. I do not miss it.

Even though I do not miss it I will second the observation that the initial leaving was very painful. I was thinking consciously about the problems of fitting the Book of Mormon story with the story of world history and story of the Americas. I think other problems were hiding in the back ground. It felt like being sucked into a hell of uncertainty. I can remember being on my knees praying about the Book of Mormon and sliding into a sense of total fear and uncertainty. I feared going mad. I decided that stepping back from the inquiry was necessary to preserve sanity. There must be other grounds for understanding reality, other grounds with less threat of insanity. There are. There are a variety of other possibities.

Advice? find other ways to understand the world. If Mormonism formed your reality growing up it will take time to understand the world from a different vantage point.(years) Might as well get started.