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I'm reading books on Anabaptist, Mennonites, Quakers etc. Here was something from a book I just received in the mail. Also, are there papers from FARMS addressing how unique the "and it came to pass" phrase is? I haven't even got to the polygamy part yet.



From the book “THE ANABAPTIST STORY” BY WILLIAM R. ESTEP

PAGE 13

The Birth of Anabaptism


A few days later, January 21, 1525, a dozen or so men slowly drudged through the snow. Quietly but resolutely, singly or in pairs they came by night to the home of Felix Manz, near the Grossmunster. The chill of the winder wind blowing off the lake did not match the chill of disappointment that gripped the little band that fateful night.

The dramatic events of the unforgettable gathering have been preserved in THE LARGE CHRONICLES OF THE HUTTERIAN BRETHREN. The account bears the earmarks of an eyewitness, who was probably Jorg Kajakob, called George Blaurock, a priest who had recently come to Zurich from Chur.



And it came to pass that they were together until anxiety came upon them, yes they were pressed within their hearts. Thereupon they began to bow their knees to the Most High God in heaven and called upon him as the Informer of Hearts, and they prayed that he would give to them his divine will and that he would show his mercy unto them. For flesh and blood and human forwardness did not drive them, since they well knew what they would have to suffer on account.

After the prayer, George of the House of Jacob stood up besought Conrad Grebel for God’s sake to baptize him with the true Christian baptism upon his faith and knowledge. And when he knelt down with such a request and desire, Conrad baptized him, since at the time there was no ordained minister to perform such work.


After the baptism at the hands of Grebel, Blaurock proceeded to baptize all the others present. The newly baptized then pledged themselves as true disciples of Christ to live lives separated from the world and to teach the gospel and hold faith.


Anabaptism was born. With this first baptism, the earliest church of the Swiss Brethren was constituted. This was clearly the most revolutionary act of the reformation. No other even so completely symbolized the break with Rome. Here, for the first time in the course of the Reformation, a group of Christians dared to form a church after what was conceived to be the New Testament pattern. The Brethren emphasized the absolute necessity of a person commitment to Christ as essential to salvation and a prerequisite to baptism.

one more - just skimming:

page 155.

The publication of Rothman's Bekentnisse became the signal for the apostles of the New Jerusalem to make their appearance. On January 5, 1534, Bartholomeus Bockbinder and William de Kuiper, disciples of Jan Mattys, arrived in Munster and initiated believers baptism, Soon Jan van Leyden followed.

As Enoch (Jan Matthys) and King David (Jan of Leyden) took charge, Rothman was captivated by their bold dreams.....

Reading the Book of Mormon is much more fun if you read "And it came to pass" as "And it came to pass gas". Makes me laugh every time.

silentkid wrote:Reading the Book of Mormon is much more fun if you read "And it came to pass" as "And it came to pass gas". Makes me laugh every time.

Anabaptist were persecuted worse than Mormons.

http://www.anabaptistchurch.org/chronicle2.htm

karl61 wrote:Anabaptist were persecuted worse than Mormons.
http://www.anabaptistchurch.org/chronicle2.htm

So they are more true, based on persecution.

Something :
I think the adjective true has comparative and superlative.
The idea of true hasn't. Something can be true or can't.

"I know the church is true the Book of Mormon is true Joseph Smith was true and now we has a true prophet."
- - - - - or not

Something :
1. The anabaptists don't baptise with sprinkling?
2. The anabaptists don't baptise with full immersion?
Think about it. It is not just the same.

Hi Karl,

Good choice. A great book. Lots of excellent stuff has been written on Anabaptism and Mormonism, by the way. Wait till you read about Muntzer and Mathijs. They were like Joseph Smith prototypes in many important respects.

Peace,

-Chris

silentkid wrote:Reading the Book of Mormon is much more fun if you read "And it came to pass" as "And it came to pass gas". Makes me laugh every time.

"And I came in my pants"?

I got a new little booklet in the mail titled: WHO ARE THE ANABAPTIST BY DONALD B. KRAYBILL

ON PAGE 4:

RADICAL ROOTS

The Anabptist story began in 1525 Switzerland when a group of young adults baptized each other in a private home. Such an event today would hardly provoke a stir, but in the early days of the Protestant Reformation, adult baptism was an outrageous act of defiance. The young reformers were nicknamed "Anabaptist," meaning "rebaptizers" because they had already been baptized as infants.

Impatient with the pace of the Protestant Reformation, the radical reformers called for a cleaner break form Catholic traditions and a sharper separation of church and state. they refused to baptize their babies, raised questions about the mass, scorned the use of images, and criticized the moraility of church officials. The Anabaptist argued that only adults, who had made a voluntary decision to follow Jesus should be baptized.

Adult baptism became the public symbol of the Anabaptist movement, but the deeper issue was one of authority. Should goverment officials prescribe religious practices, such as infant baptism,or was the Bible the sole and final authority for the church? For the Anabaptist, Scriptures and the Holy Spirit were teh ultimate authorities. Indeed, they were willing to obey the teachings of Christ even if it brought the executioners sword.

The young reformers shook the pillars of civil authority because infant baptism conferred membership into both Catholic and Protestant Churches. Baptism also granted citizenship and gave authorities the power to tax and conscript. Anabaptist convictions tore asunder the threads that had woven social, relgious and political life into a single fabric over the centuries. the refusal of Anabaptist to baptize ifnrants, swear oaths of allegiance, and obey established tradition outraged both political and religious authorities.

Leaders of the new movement were dubbed heretics and banned from many areas. They fled for their lives and often met in secret for worship. Thousands of them were killed by cruel and torturous tactics. They were branded, burned, drowned, imprisoned and often dismembered. Stories of the bloody carnage can still be read today in the Martyrs Mirror, a book of some 1200 pages.

Propelled by persecution and missionary zeal, the movement mushroomed in many areas of Europe. Some Anabaptist found refuge in Moravia, Alsace, the Palatinate, the Netherlands, Poland, and later in the Ukraine and eventually in North America.

I liked this part.

The Anabaptist argued that only adults, who had made a voluntary decision to follow Jesus should be baptized.

Adult baptism became the public symbol of the Anabaptist movement, but the deeper issue was one of authority. Should government officials prescribe religious practices, such as infant baptism,or was the Bible the sole and final authority for the church? For the Anabaptist, Scriptures and the Holy Spirit were the ultimate authorities. Indeed, they were willing to obey the teachings of Christ even if it brought the executioners sword.

The young reformers shook the pillars of civil authority because infant baptism conferred membership into both Catholic and Protestant Churches



Although Mormons don't baptize their infants they do have child baptism.