Utah Court Dismisses Most Claims Against LDS Church

[_Kishkumen]

Utah Court Dismisses Most Claims Against LDS Church Over Ordination Of Sons

In the Mormon Church, children at age 12 are generally receive priesthood ordinances. Michael Gulbraa, who had legal custody of his two sons-- improperly taken to Japan by his former wife-- asked the LDS Church not to proceed with the ceremony for his sons without his permission. The Church ignored his request and proceeded with the ceremony "for the children's benefit". The father sued for damages and injunctive relief.

In Gulbraa v. Corporation of the President of the Church of Jesus Christof Latter-day Saints, (UT Ct. App., April 19, 2007), a Utah Court of Appeals dismissed the father's claims for breach of contract, fraud, and negligent misrepresentation, and his request for injunctive relief. It said that adjudicating the claims would excessively entangle the court in the Church's religious operations, the interpretation of its teachings, the performance of its ceremonies, or the governance of its affairs. An award of damages would require the court to place a monetary value on participation in religious experiences. However, the court permitted the father to proceed with his claim for intentional infliction of emotional distress. Today's Salt Lake Tribune reports on the decision. (See prior related posting.)

From Religion Clause posted 2007-04-20.

[_harmony]

How many of the judges are LDS?

[_LDSDoubter]

I can believe that fighting the church in a Utah court would be futile. I wonder if a member decided to sue the church for fraud after quitting, if the suit would have to be in Utah courts or the member's home state. I know I saw an antimormon website about a year ago that had a class-action suit that former members could join but I noticed that it has since been taken down, so maybe they realized they couldn't do it. I know in some cases, if it could be proven the missionaries didn't present the whole truth, a person could probably win easily, at least on back-tithing.

[_It occurs to me . . .]

Elder Gulbraa Was my mission trainer, there are a few tales I could tell, but I really feel for the hell he has gone through with his sons,

[_quaker]

At what age will the father let his children make their own decisions?

[_TAK]

Elder Gulbraa Was my mission trainer, there are a few tales I could tell, ...

None of which would have anything to do w/ the Church ignoring a fathers wishes. Nice smear though ..

I really feel for the hell he has gone through with his sons,

I rather doubt that..

[_harmony]

It looks to me like a couple of things were going on:

1) the court didn't want to get into the inner workings of the church, for fear of overstepping the separation between church and state, which might have eventually made it to the Supreme Court and an overhaul of the constitution. They weren't willing to take that on.

2) they saw it as a family issue, not a legal issue. If the father could prove his sons were somehow harmed, then it becomes a legal issue, but he couldn't.

3) and I wonder how many of the judges are LDS.

[_Morrissey]

It looks to me like a couple of things were going on:

1) the court didn't want to get into the inner workings of the church, for fear of overstepping the separation between church and state, which might have eventually made it to the Supreme Court and an overhaul of the constitution. They weren't willing to take that on.

2) they saw it as a family issue, not a legal issue. If the father could prove his sons were somehow harmed, then it becomes a legal issue, but he couldn't.

3) and I wonder how many of the judges are LDS.

An interesting follow-up question, I wonder how many LDS judges would issue a ruling contrary to the interests of the LDS Church? That is, when push comes to shove, which has greater weight--fealty to the law, or fealty to the tribe?

All I know is that were I involved in a legal tussle with LDS Inc., I certainly would not want an LDS judge.

[_zzyzx]

Any LDS leader who works with kids against the stated wishes of the parents should be taken to task over it.

Teaching respect for parents while ignoring their stated wishes is dishonest. Almost as stupid as thinking all has to be written down because maybe God can't remember what we have done here on earth?

[_LDSDoubter]

I'm hoping I can take them to local small claims when I go to get my back tithing back. I would not want to sue this church in Utah. I think any judge outside of Utah that is not LDS can see the ridiculousness of this scam. I know Utah is said to be the number one state for scams anyway, and I hear it is where most of the MLMs and pyramids come from. I remember one came to a hotel in my area from Utah and put on a "get rich quick" seminar. I think they congregate there because LDS leaders have made the laws so lax so they can get away with what they do on a regular basis. I just hope that I'm not required to take any claims against them to Utah, usually I think you have to sign something saying you will only sue in a company's home state.