God loves ranchers, and hates farmers.

[_Sethbag]

Ok, interesting title. Let me explain. I was thinking about this the other day when I was shopping in Costco, and thought I'd post it up here and see how you guys think about this topic.

Cain and Abel.

From Genesis chapter 4:

1 And Adam knew Eve his wife; and she conceived, and bare Cain, and said, I have gotten a man from the Lord.
2 And she again bare his brother Abel. And Abel was a keeper of sheep, but Cain was a tiller of the ground.
3 And in process of time it came to pass, that Cain brought of the fruit of the ground an offering unto the Lord.
4 And Abel, he also brought of the firstlings of his flock and of the fat thereof. And the Lord had respect unto Abel and to his offering:
5 But unto Cain and to his offering he had not respect. And Cain was very wroth, and his countenance fell.
6 And the Lord said unto Cain, Why art thou wroth? and why is thy countenance fallen?
7 If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him.

Ok, so by profession, Cain was a farmer. When it came time to offer sacrifice of his first fruits, he brought forth an offering of the products of his labor - of the fruit of the ground.

And the Lord dissed him. Cain brought forth an offering of the fruits of his labor, and the Lord rejected him, because his offering wasn't meat? Because there was no blood?

I know the true believers will stand up and say that the Lord rejecting Cain's offering of the fruits of his labors as a farmer makes perfect sense, because burning some wheat, or figs, or apples, or whatever, just doesn't serve as a "type" for the slaughter of a human being to come, ie: the human sacrifice of Jesus Christ.

And, I guess, any sacrifice by a person that cannot somehow remind a person of the necessity of human sacrifice, just isn't going to work. Sorry, Cain, I know that you're a farmer, that you grow crops, till the earth, sow seeds, pull weeds, harvest the crops, thresh the wheat, pick the figs, gather in the grapes or whatever it was, but sacrificing some of these goods just doesn't work. In fact, having offered up some wheat, instead of something with blood in it, you've just proven that you really love SATAN more than you love Elohim. Now you get to be turned into a Black man, and wander the Earth as Bigfoot forever, or at least until the Millenium, in several thousand years. Bummer, dude.

So, I guess Elohim loves ranchers more than farmers.

You know, when you read this stuff from outside of the protective matrix of the believer's worldview, it just makes no sense at all. Believers really are forced to incorporate some bizarre ancient bronze-age mythology into their worldview, and the result is human sacrifice as a virtue, wheat-burner being damned because he didn't kill an animal instead, and all of the abominations of Old Testament justice, ethnic cleansing, genocide, and violent religious oppression.

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[_truth dancer]

Hey Seth,

Yep.. when we stop and think what the stories tell us about God, we see the the Divine in a while new way!

Ever read Ishmael By David Quinn?

Ishmael

It is an unusual book but discusses a theory about human life and how the early stories in the Bible have moved human development in a particular way.

Basically, David analyzes the story of Cain and Abel and theorizes that it is a myth derived from the human evolutionary movement when the nomadic herders overtook the agrarian societies. Quite interesting and thought provoking actually.

IMHO, it makes much more sense to believe the C&A story was created by the nomadic tribal men as an excuse to destroy those who were different than it does to believe the God of the Universe was obsessed with animal blood; enough that he would eternally damn anyone (and all their posterity) who gave the wrong sacrifice.

Quinn ( Dreamer ) won the Turner Tomorrow Award's half-million-dollar first prize for this fascinating and odd book--not a novel by any conventional definition--which was written 13 years ago but could not find a publisher. The unnamed narrator is a disillusioned modern writer who answers a personal ad ("Teacher seeks pupil. . . . Apply in person.") and thereby meets a wise, learned gorilla named Ishmael that can communicate telepathically. The bulk of the book consists entirely of philosophical dialogues between gorilla and man, on the model of Plato's Republic. Through Ishmael, Quinn offers a wide-ranging if highly general examination of the history of our civilization, illuminating the assumptions and philosophies at the heart of many global problems. Despite some gross oversimplifications, Quinn's ideas are fairly convincing; it's hard not to agree that unrestrained population growth and an obsession with conquest and control of the environment are among the key issues of our times. Quinn also traces these problems back to the agricultural revolution and offers a provocative rereading of the biblical stories of Genesis. Though hardly any plot to speak of lies behind this long dialogue, Quinn's smooth style and his intriguing proposals should hold the attention of readers interested in the daunting dilemmas that beset our planet. 50,000 first printing; major ad/promo.

Bold mine.

~td~

[_The Nehor]

As the sacrifice of the first of your crop is acceptable elsewhere one must look for other reasons Cain's sacrifice was rejected.

[_Some Schmo]

As the sacrifice of the first of your crop is acceptable elsewhere one must look for other reasons Cain's sacrifice was rejected.

I think it's pretty straightforward, actually. If prophets and scripture have taught us anything, it's that god is a capricious dick. I don't think we really need to analyze it beyond that.

Sure, you can make whatever excuses you want for him, but really, he's just not very nice or loving. Making excuses for god seems to be along the same lines as an abused wife sticking up for her husband when the cops come on a domestic abuse call.

[_harmony]

Any relation to Mike Quinn?

[_The Nehor]

I think it's pretty straightforward, actually. If prophets and scripture have taught us anything, it's that god is a capricious dick. I don't think we really need to analyze it beyond that.

So if it's complicated fall back on what seems simple to avoid having to think about it? Got it.

Sure, you can make whatever excuses you want for him, but really, he's just not very nice or loving. Making excuses for god seems to be along the same lines as an abused wife sticking up for her husband when the cops come on a domestic abuse call.

I disagree wholeheartedly with everything you just said.

[_Some Schmo]

I think it's pretty straightforward, actually. If prophets and scripture have taught us anything, it's that god is a capricious dick. I don't think we really need to analyze it beyond that.

So if it's complicated fall back on what seems simple to avoid having to think about it? Got it.

Huh? When did I say it was complicated? What part of "it's pretty straightforward" didn't you understand? It's religious people that try to make it complicated to give some kind of credibility when in reality, it's very simple.

Reading comprehension for the win!

Sure, you can make whatever excuses you want for him, but really, he's just not very nice or loving. Making excuses for god seems to be along the same lines as an abused wife sticking up for her husband when the cops come on a domestic abuse call.

I disagree wholeheartedly with everything you just said.

Well, that's always a good sign. Makes me feel like I'm on the right track.

[_Gazelam]

Seth,

Adam instructed both Cain and Abel in the necesity of offering sacrifice to God. The acceptance and rejection of the offerings was not a one time occasion, but multiple occasions over time.

The question of acceptance came because of the attitude. Abel sought to follow his Fathers example, accompanying his offerings with prayer and fasting. Cain from the time of his youth listened to the whisperings and deceipt of lucifer, hardening his heart against his parents, his brother, and the Lord. Lucifer also appeared to Abel, but Abel rejected him.

Cain did not see the sense in burning up the eartly goods he had worked so hard to raise up, whether it was his crops or his herd. When he made his offerings it was not his best, but his worst that he was more comfortable in losing. His heart was upon the things of this world.

[_Sethbag]

Where does it say Cain offered up his worst? I don't recall reading that.

[_The Nehor]

So if it's complicated fall back on what seems simple to avoid having to think about it? Got it.

Huh? When did I say it was complicated? What part of "it's pretty straightforward" didn't you understand? It's religious people that try to make it complicated to give some kind of credibility when in reality, it's very simple.

Reading comprehension for the win!

I understood what you were saying completely. I was pointing out that your endless oversimplifications are common and that you fall back on them when confronted. I never claimed you admitted it.

Well, that's always a good sign. Makes me feel like I'm on the right track.

Living by such a negative standard explains much. Thanks for clarifying.