The genius of Michael R. Ash

[_Dr. Shades]

Most of us here are familiar with the apologist known as Mike Ash, who goes by the username "MAsh" both here and at the aptly named MA&D board. He's the author of Shaken Faith Syndrome (endorsed by defeated Book of Abraham apologist Brian Hauglid) and Of Faith and Reason (endorsed by "rommelator" over at MA&D). He's also noted for his 23 recent articles at mormontimes.com, as have sometimes been drawn to our attention here by mms.

I've read as many excerpts from his books as possible, and I've been rather critical of them. Yet the thing that struck me the most is how they're essentially no different from the run-of-the-mill junior-tier apologetics at MA&D.

Normally, that alone would be cause for criticism. Shouldn't one amp up the quality when it comes to the printed word?

Then it hit me: That's the very source of Mike Ash's genius! Think about it: He, in essence, lets the MA&Dites write his books for him! They provide him his material for free, and he simply cuts-and-pastes it between two covers!

You know, some of the best money-making ideas are the simplest. It just takes that rare genius to come along and do it first.

So, kudos to Mike Ash for having the genius to ride that particular gravy train!

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[_Ray A]

Apologetic books of such a nature are only temporary stop gaps, essentially plugging holes in the Titanic. This is how it was with me and FARMS. Quite bedazzled by it for some five years, I eventually lost all interest and stopped subscribing in the late '90s. Mike's defences, though I've only read excerpts, would have to be old rehashes of all the old and worn out arguments, for Book of Mormon historicity, for example.

My reading of excerpts leads me to believe that it's a primer for novice apostates-in-the-making. Like me, they may hold off while they weigh the arguments and then finally decide. Nothing wrong with that, and a responsible person should take the time to make those comparisons. With hindsight I now view it as a necessary waste of time.

Another thing you must remember, for apologists, apologia has become more important than the Gospel itself, which is likely to bore the hell out some of them during Sunday School. Witness Pa Pa's attempts to make this weekly faith-promoting factory "more interesting".

[_Dr. Shades]

Another thing you must remember, for apologists, apologia has become more important than the Gospel itself, which is likely to bore the hell out some of them during Sunday School.

I previously made the observation that MA&D isn't about defending Mormonism. MA&D is about defending Mormon apologetics.

Witness Pa Pa's attempts to make this weekly faith-promoting factory "more interesting".

What has he done to make it more interesting?

Either way, neither of my comments have anything to do with Mike Ash.

Do you have any comments about his particular stroke of genius?

[Guest]

Michael was just emulating his idol Joseph. Take the works of other, get it printed and pass it off as something else.

Just as long as Brother Ash stops there when trying to be like Brother Joseph.

Next time he should pay someone to d a profession job on the book cover.

This one screams AMATEUR to the point I expect spiral binding.

Is that Bro Ash in the lower left corner? And his duaghter in the upper right corner?



The older man in the corner look more like an evangelical minister to me. I wonder if Mormons think the same and do not buy the book by judging the cover to be a evangelical book?

[_Ray A]

What has he done to make it more interesting?

I don't know. I've always found such threads too boring to participate in. I'm only reflecting what he has sometimes said.

Either way, neither of my comments have anything to do with Mike Ash.

But they are related to Mike Ash, and his genius. I wouldn't agree that all of his apologetics come from MAD, nor that it's a good way to make a buck. After all, who among TBMs, and I'm talking about real life TBMs, the people you refer to as "Chapel Mormons", even bother to take apologetics seriously? Even the staunchest TBMs I have known in real life knew absolutely nothing about the "Chief Apologist", though increasingly others have become familiar with the name "Nibley" over the years. In the 1980s and 90s I might as well have referred to the works Lobsang Rampa and they still wouldn't have a clue what I was talking about.

You may have seen a post I did about my recent encounter with two missionaries. I asked them if they knew who DCP was. Who? Ting-a-ling-ding - it's 2009. In the real world of TBMs MAD is no more significant than MDB.

I would not imagine Mike could retire on his profits - much less live "handsomely".

Do you have any comments about his particular stroke of genius?

Unoriginal. I don't see any genius, and if I saw a spark there, I'd read his books properly. Same old, same old. Offenders For A Word is probably one of the better books in this genre, and had nothing to do with MAD. Even that remains obscure to Brother and Sister Molly.

[_Polygamy-Porter]

Additionally, perhaps Mike wrote the book as he would rather not have doubting members getting bitch slapped by the mighty mo'pologetic hand of one Dr. Daniel C. Peterson in the MA&D Asylum as he gleefully exclaims "I cut my baby teeth on the angels flaming sword! WHAT IS YOUR PROBLEM?!?!?"

God forbid a new member with an opening post of "I was never taught about __________" This awakens the rabidly pious pitbulls of the MA&D kennel who all clamor over each other as they hope to be the one to deliver the bite-to-the-neck response within nano seconds of new poster's index finger lifting from the left mouse button that clicked the submit button.

[_Dr. Shades]

I wouldn't agree that all of his apologetics come from MAD, nor that it's a good way to make a buck. After all, who among TBMs, and I'm talking about real life TBMs, the people you refer to as "Chapel Mormons", even bother to take apologetics seriously?

I wouldn't argue that he makes a lot of bucks, but he has an extremely high ratio of time invested vs. dollar return.

[_CaliforniaKid]

Is that Bro Ash in the lower left corner?

Nope. Having met Brother Ash at Sunstone last summer, I can testify that he is considerably younger and better looking than that. Although not quite as young and good looking as me. But hey, we can't all be perfect, right?

[_Ray A]

I wouldn't argue that he makes a lot of bucks, but he has an extremely high ratio of time invested vs. dollar return.

I think, honestly, many apologists write these books to try to convince themselves as much as those who are experiencing what they experienced - "Shaken faith syndrome". It's a spin-off of Packer's "well-spring of faith antidote"; tell yourself something is true over and over - and eventually you'll believe it.

[_Dr. Shades]

I think, honestly, many apologists write these books to try to convince themselves as much as those who are experiencing what they experienced - "Shaken faith syndrome". It's a spin-off of Packer's "well-spring of faith antidote"; tell yourself something is true over and over - and eventually you'll believe it.

Interestingly, after Chris Tolworthy lost his faith, he admitted that what you described above was indeed the reason why he created all his apologetic websites.