Fudging the Numbers at "Mormon Scholars Testify"?

[Guest]

A recent posting from Dr. Peterson led me to double check something on the slowly declining Mopologetic website (and Chapel Mormon agitprop piece) called, "Mormon Scholars Testify." Not terribly long ago, I pointed out that the rapid rate of postings to the site would inevitably slow, which led to an explosively angry outburst from the apologists, who insisted that the site was as healthy as ever. And indeed, only a few testimonies appear to have been added since I last made this observation.

But just recently, something else caught my eye: namely, the attempt on the homepage to brag about the vast diversity of "schools/institutions" represented:

Statistics
Number of testimonies: 63
Number of schools/organizations represented: 34

Are there really and truly "34" "schools/organizations" represented? Or, are the FAIR & FARMS people stretching the numbers in order to make it seem as if there is a huge diversity of TBM scholarly representation out there? (Afterall, in its initial "heyday," DCP boasted that the site had gone "global.") Well, let's break this down. Here, going straight through the testimonies, is a list of the "schools/organizations represented":

1. BYU
2. SDSU
3. BYU-I
4. (LDS) Family History Library
5. Collin College
6. Griffith University
7. Drake University
8. William & Mary
9. USU
10. "Private Industry" [???]
11. The MoTab
12. Washington St.
13. Institute for Ethnomedicine
14. Lawrence Berkeley Laboratory
15. UNC Chapel Hill
16. U. of Sydney
17. NASA
18. Idaho State
19. "Public Policy" (Queensland, Australia)
20. Montana State
21. "Government and Industry"
22. U. of Utah
23. "Law and Ancient Languages"
24. Newcastle University
25. "Law and Analytic Philosophy"
26. Columbia U.
27. U of Texas @ Austin
28. Foundation for Interreligious Diplomacy
29. Western Carolina U.
30. Indiana U.
31. BYU-Hawai'i
32. UNC Asheville
33. U. of Michigan
34. CES of Sydney
35. Harvard
36. ???

I'm could be that they are counting the Maxwell Institute, which would equal 36 "schools/organizations," but that still seems awfully problematic to me. Kristine Wardle Fredrickson apparently has a dual appointment at BYU and UVU, so are they counting UVU? It's tough to tell.

In any event, what I found striking here is how poor, in light of the claims, the diversity actually is. For one thing, I don't think that the various BYU campuses should be allowed to count towards MST's claims for "global reach," or its bloated "schools/organizations represented" count. The same goes for things like the MoTab, the Family History Library, and CES. A further problem is associated with the folks who appear to be independent scholars (these are the ones I put in "quotes.") I hate to break it to the MST administrators, but "Private Industry" is not an "organization," let alone a scholarsly organization. If we were to remove these problematic entries from the list, and if we were to collapse all the BYU campuses into one, then the claims about "schools/organizations" represented would be very paltry indeed.

The bottom line here is that the MST's claims about representation are grossly inaccurate. I hope they set about revising this immediately, before the site declines even further into oblivion and uselessness.

[_Gadianton]

You know professor, this whole thing is a little odd. First of all, what does it mean to "represent" an organization as a bearer of testimony? I mean think about this: The MI boldly announces on every essay they publish that the views don't "represent" the MI - the MI is an explicit apologetics mill printing explicit apologetics, yet even still, the individuals published don't in any way "represent" the MI. Yet, if a TBM teaches law or business at Harvard, and also believes in Mormonism, then his or her testimony somehow "represents" Harvard? In what way is it understood that these individuals represent the places they work for?

I also agree counting private companies is problematic, given the work (even if far more intellectually demanding than a lot of academic work) isn't technically "scholarship." And how meaningful is it to say that Mormons have jobs at different places? I mean, given there are thirteen million Mormons, would anyone expect that all 13 million worked within the same 8 companies? Oh wow, Mormons have managed to find jobs at at least 34 different places, holy crap, call the missionaries in!

But there is more to this as well. Your tremendous and original scholarship here, Doctor Scratch, has now inspired a similar research project of my own.

[_The Nehor]

They claim they represent 34 schools according to you but it is "awfully problematic" that you're unsure what the 36th is?

Might I suggest some remedial study in elementary school-level counting?

[_Doctor Scratch]

They claim they represent 34 schools according to you but it is "awfully problematic" that you're unsure what the 36th is?

Might I suggest some remedial study in elementary school-level counting?

How many "schools/organizations" are represented on the site, Nehor?

[_Dr. Shades]

The MI boldly announces on every essay they publish that the views don't "represent" the MI - the MI is an explicit apologetics mill printing explicit apologetics, yet even still, the individuals published don't in any way "represent" the MI. Yet, if a TBM teaches law or business at Harvard, and also believes in Mormonism, then his or her testimony somehow "represents" Harvard? In what way is it understood that these individuals represent the places they work for?

That's an excellent point. Thanks for pointing it out.

[_Nimrod]

"Fudging the numbers? Nah. That's not what is, Elder Peterson. We're just telling the Zone Leaders what they want to hear. We're working hard and you don't want the Mission President to transfer one of us, do you?" Perhaps something Professor Dan's trainer told him when he was a young, new missionary.

[_Kevin Graham]

Gadianton beat me to it, as I thought the same exact thing when it said these people "represented" these schools. So one person working for University X happens to be a Mormon, therefore he "represents" that University as a Mormon testimony bearer? This is downright dumb, if not deceptive. It suggests the University signs its approval of his testimony, which we all know to be nonsense.

I think maybe Dan Peterson has successfully deluded himself as to the significance of MST. I mean if he really thinks these people "represent" 30+ prestigious, non-Mormon Universities, and he thinks they all support the notion that the Mormon testimony has intellectual integrity, then no wonder he is so excited about this project.

[_Kevin Graham]

Oh wow, Mormons have managed to find jobs at at least 34 different places, holy crap, call the missionaries in!

ROFL!

[_Manfred]

Is it possible that MST is using represent to mean "serve as an example of," and not "to speak and act for by delegated authority"? There's certainly a difference between these two meanings, and I imagine MST probably has in mind the former.

[_Gadianton]

Hi Manfred,

Hope you are doing well. Hmmm. No, I don't think that really works. Or do you mean the way "represented" is used in chemistry? Doesn't seem to fit either, to me.

Manfred, not sure how long you've been around the boards, but this is a noted FAIRism, and is the influence of primarily one person who is obsessed with how "scholarly" Mormonism is (I'm not talking about DCP). In the contexts of endless past discussions, apologists with advanced degrees have been offered as representatives of proper academic perspective on religious matters whereas critics come to the table with outdated or amateurish methods/objections. An example:

If Brent Metcalfe says X about the Book of Abraham and John Gee says Y, then certain FAIRites will say that Y represents the methods and learning of Yale(?) while X represents inane ideas from a high school dropout. In this context the argument is a major appeal to authority. But based on how often this argument has been made, and how often this study has been cited within the same conversations using virtually identical language to how it appears on MST, I'd say it's 99% likely that the intention is that the "scholars" represent their schools in precisely this "appeal to authority" way.