You can't have it both ways

[Guest]

One of my favorites, raguel, is
Don't put your faith in the arm of flesh--unless its an arm of the Brethren.

It is interesting to find the conflicts when you apply critical thinking.

Here is another recent one:

Joseph Smith did not practice polygamy, he was just sealed to other women.

Ask these people who made that statement:
Q: What does the LDS church call these sealed unions?
A: They call them marriages on FamilySearch.org and the history calls the plural wives. NOT "sealings"

Q: The scriptures claim that polygamy was for what purpose?
A: Babies, Mormon babies.

Q: To make a baby, at least back then, required what?
A: Sperm in the uterus, via penis in the va-jay-jay, a.k.a. SEX.

Q: Why would God expect all of the other polygs before and after Smith to hump like rabbits to make more babies, but Smith was the ONLY one not doing it?
A: Perhaps this is the reason he was off'd at Carthage?
The above answer is a good lead-in into the flaming sword story.

[_Raguel]

1. Critical thinking involves creating a strawman (Church wants you to rely unconditionally on the Brethren) when they teach the opposite.

Follow me for a second, Nehor. When the Brethren speak, you either (a) believe or (b) not believe. If you choose to not believe, aren't you following the apostates?

Elder Bruce R. McConkie taught: “Faith is a gift of God bestowed as a reward for personal righteousness. It is always given when righteousness is present, and the greater the measure of obedience to God’s laws the greater will be the endowment of faith” (Mormon Doctrine, 2nd ed. [1966], 264). If we desire more faith, we must be more obedient. When we teach our children by example or precept to be casual or situational in obeying God’s commandments, we prevent them from receiving this vital spiritual gift. Faith requires an attitude of exact obedience, even in the small, simple things.

Just in case you need to brush up on the Conference talk, here is a link to the May 2009 edition of the Ensign:
http://lds.org/ldsorg/v/index.jsp?hideNav=1&locale=0&sourceId=162a230bac7f0210VgnVCM100000176f620a____&vgnextoid=2354fccf2b7db010VgnVCM1000004d82620aRCRD

2. Then, bring this up as if it is a brilliant deduction rather [than] an inane and untrue point flatly contradicted by the evidence and experiences of those involved.

Where is the evidence? Are you admitting to not following the Brethren?

[_Polygamy-Porter]

1. Critical thinking involves creating a strawman (Church wants you to rely unconditionally on the Brethren) when they teach the opposite.

Follow me for a second, Nehor. When the Brethren speak, you either (a) believe or (b) not believe. If you choose to not believe, aren't you following the apostates?

Elder Bruce R. McConkie taught: “Faith is a gift of God bestowed as a reward for personal righteousness. It is always given when righteousness is present, and the greater the measure of obedience to God’s laws the greater will be the endowment of faith” (Mormon Doctrine, 2nd ed. [1966], 264). If we desire more faith, we must be more obedient. When we teach our children by example or precept to be casual or situational in obeying God’s commandments, we prevent them from receiving this vital spiritual gift. Faith requires an attitude of exact obedience, even in the small, simple things.

Just in case you need to brush up on the Conference talk, here is a link to the May 2009 edition of the Ensign:
http://lds.org/ldsorg/v/index.jsp?hideNav=1&locale=0&sourceId=162a230bac7f0210VgnVCM100000176f620a____&vgnextoid=2354fccf2b7db010VgnVCM1000004d82620aRCRD

2. Then, bring this up as if it is a brilliant deduction rather [than] an inane and untrue point flatly contradicted by the evidence and experiences of those involved.

Where is the evidence? Are you admitting to not following the Brethren?

Nice work Raguel.

Nehor is a TBM fixture here on this board who serves a purpose of the representing the TBM fools that we could not stand while we were members. Rail against him early and often as it brings about great thankfulness that we(exmos) are no longer surrounded by people like him.

[_alvatra]

We all have to TRY to find common ground somehow, right? Or is that just "Those Mormons"?

[_Dr. Shades]

We all have to TRY to find common ground somehow, right? Or is that just "Those Mormons"?

Yes, we all have to find common ground.

A good place to start is if we ALL dedicate ourselves to uncovering truth, no matter how inconvenient or painful that truth may be.

[_The Nehor]

1. Critical thinking involves creating a strawman (Church wants you to rely unconditionally on the Brethren) when they teach the opposite.

Follow me for a second, Nehor. When the Brethren speak, you either (a) believe or (b) not believe. If you choose to not believe, aren't you following the apostates?

Yes, but that's not unconditional reliance. If God tells to stop following the Brethren, I will.

[_The Nehor]

Nehor is a TBM fixture here on this board who serves a purpose of the representing the TBM fools that we could not stand while we were members. Rail against him early and often as it brings about great thankfulness that we(exmos) are no longer surrounded by people like him.

Thanks for fulfilling scripture for me. It reminds me I'm on the right track.

[_Runtu]

Yes, but that's not unconditional reliance. If God tells to stop following the Brethren, I will.

Wouldn't that make you an apostate? Either that, or you're saying that the Brethren had apostatized. How is that any different from, say, Nightlion?

[_The Nehor]

Yes, but that's not unconditional reliance. If God tells to stop following the Brethren, I will.

Wouldn't that make you an apostate?

From their point of view, probably. To God, no. I'm okay with.

Either that, or you're saying that the Brethren had apostatized.

They haven't and revelation leads me to believe they won't...on the whole at least.

How is that any different from, say, Nightlion?

I won't base my decision and the gospel that I follow on rock formations.

[_Baker]

If your god, for all practical purposes, IS your church, you will never find yourself in a position of conflict.