Mormon Joy-What is it?

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_why me
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Re: Mormon Joy-What is it?

Post by _why me »

liz3564 wrote:I have always thought of joy as being synonymous with family. I doubt this perception would change for me whether I was in the Church or out.


Not exactly since many families have no joy...only misery. But joy=love and if one loves god, one obeys his commandments to the best of one's ability. And accepts imperfections in oneself.
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_huckelberry
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Re: Mormon Joy-What is it?

Post by _huckelberry »

Hoops notes,"I don't think Jesus was ever asking us to conjure up an emotion as some kind affirmation of anything. Joy is opposite of that, though an emotion can and will coincide. But coincendental emotion is not the thing itself. That's His point."

Huckelberry notes, I am some times reminded of what a thick jungle of assumption sometimes clog discussion of religious topics. I am sure this applies to how I hear you as well as how you hear me. I have no wish to be hostile but sounding that way may be short cut to clarification.

I have no idea where this business of conjuring an emotion comes from. What I said was pretty much the opposite. Real action for real relationships is joy.
_huckelberry
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Re: Mormon Joy-What is it?

Post by _huckelberry »

Hoops suggested I was speaking some alien doctrines. (?)

Galatians 5: 6 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircomcision has any value . The only thing that counts is faith expressing itself through love.

5:13 You my brother were called to be free but do not use your freedom to indulge the sinful nature . Rather serve one another in love.The entire law is summed up in a single command, Love your neighbor as yourself.

Just to point out a couple of many similar comments. Romans 12 is a favorite of mine. Not too mention 4 Gospels which persue a similar view.

In choosing the word friendship did it sound as if I was speaking of something different?
Is one to consider Christian love as being other than friendship, that is true friendship?
_just me
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Re: Mormon Joy-What is it?

Post by _just me »

I can agree with love bringing joy. Deep and abiding love for self, mankind and the divine certainly bring much joy. I find that I always feel an overwhelming gratitude along with love and joy.

I guess I just believe it is available to everyone on earth....not just christians.
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_zeezrom
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Re: Mormon Joy-What is it?

Post by _zeezrom »

just me wrote:I guess I just believe it is available to everyone on earth....not just christians.

I agree. I think everyone would be Christians if Christians truly had more cumulative amounts of the Joy emotion than any other.
Oh for shame, how the mortals put the blame on us gods, for they say evils come from us, but it is they, rather, who by their own recklessness win sorrow beyond what is given... Zeus (1178 BC)

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_Hoops
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Re: Mormon Joy-What is it?

Post by _Hoops »

why me wrote:
liz3564 wrote:I have always thought of joy as being synonymous with family. I doubt this perception would change for me whether I was in the Church or out.


Not exactly since many families have no joy...only misery. But joy=love and if one loves god, one obeys his commandments to the best of one's ability. And accepts imperfections in oneself.



OMG, seriously? Firstly, joy does not equal love. How can you make this statement? And if you think that obeying the commandments (which, as a gentile, I don't even know what those are), um... what does that do again?

Lastly, I'm thankful for yet another reminder of why I am thankful I am not Mormon.
_Hoops
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Re: Mormon Joy-What is it?

Post by _Hoops »

zeezrom wrote:
just me wrote:I guess I just believe it is available to everyone on earth....not just christians.

I agree. I think everyone would be Christians if Christians truly had more cumulative amounts of the Joy emotion than any other.


What does this even mean? Sorry, I'm not getting it.
_zeezrom
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Re: Mormon Joy-What is it?

Post by _zeezrom »

Hoops wrote:
zeezrom wrote:I agree. I think everyone would be Christians if Christians truly had more cumulative amounts of the Joy emotion than any other.


What does this even mean? Sorry, I'm not getting it.

If it was found that Christians were truly happier people than everyone else, I think people would change their religion and become Christian to partake in the happiness they were missing out on.
Oh for shame, how the mortals put the blame on us gods, for they say evils come from us, but it is they, rather, who by their own recklessness win sorrow beyond what is given... Zeus (1178 BC)

The Holy Sacrament.
_Hoops
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Re: Mormon Joy-What is it?

Post by _Hoops »

If it was found that Christians were truly happier people than everyone else, I think people would change their religion and become Christian to partake in the happiness they were missing out on.

Well, again, it's my understanding that joy and happiness are different things. It is Christian joy that we are "selling", not happiness. And for anyone to say otherwise, in my opinion, is not doing justice to the human condition. I'm NOT saying that we can not have happiness. Not at all. But happiness, it seems to me, is dependent on many factors, some of which we control and some we don't. To be sure, how we deal with uncontrollable factors and the mistakes we all make has an effect on our happiness. But happiness, in my opinion, is too wispy to be a good barometer of anything. Let alone one's eternal destiny.
_zeezrom
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Re: Mormon Joy-What is it?

Post by _zeezrom »

Hoops wrote:
If it was found that Christians were truly happier people than everyone else, I think people would change their religion and become Christian to partake in the happiness they were missing out on.

Well, again, it's my understanding that joy and happiness are different things. It is Christian joy that we are "selling", not happiness. And for anyone to say otherwise, in my opinion, is not doing justice to the human condition. I'm NOT saying that we can not have happiness. Not at all. But happiness, it seems to me, is dependent on many factors, some of which we control and some we don't. To be sure, how we deal with uncontrollable factors and the mistakes we all make has an effect on our happiness. But happiness, in my opinion, is too wispy to be a good barometer of anything. Let alone one's eternal destiny.

Let me go back to my original statement about joy.

Here is my thought process:

The human is able to experience feelings he/she associates with the word joy.
You can experience these feelings from certain conditions.
These start to accumulate over a lifetime, some you recall better than others after the fact.
The accumulation of these experiences and memories might have some value.
If one religion had the ability to give people a greater accumulation, and people knew about this, they would all go join that religion.

Maybe.... That is my best shot but it is open for debate.
Oh for shame, how the mortals put the blame on us gods, for they say evils come from us, but it is they, rather, who by their own recklessness win sorrow beyond what is given... Zeus (1178 BC)

The Holy Sacrament.
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