The LDS Church is destructive dangerous.

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Is the LDS Church a destructive, dangerous kind of cult

 
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_beefcalf
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Re: Buffalo thinks the LDS Church is destructive dangerous.

Post by _beefcalf »

“Also far-reaching is the effect of loss of chastity. Once given or taken or stolen it can never be regained. Even in forced contact such as rape or incest, the injured one is greatly outraged. If she has not cooperated and contributed to the foul deed, she is of course in a more favorable position. There is no condemnation where there is no voluntary participation. It is better to die in defending one’s virtue than to live having lost it without a struggle.”
–Spencer W. Kimball, The Miracle of Forgiveness.


stemelbow wrote:that's not teaching it'd be better to be dead then to lose your viriginity before marriage. he says you'd be better off dead then to lose it without a struggle. You guys sure know how to make the mountains out of molehills. I figgered that was the case.


I have a 17 year old daughter. She is beautiful, smart and very funny, and I love her very much.

Let us suppose that one evening she finds herself in a situation with a young man where they have both let their emotions and hormones get the better of them. She decides to put a stop to things but the young man is beyond listening to reason. He becomes forceful. She resists him. Soon it becomes apparent to her that it is his intention to have his way with her, regardless of her protestations. She remembers President Kimball's teachings and has a choice to make: Resist this young man, even if he murders her in the process OR stop resisting at the point that his violence becomes overwhelming in an effort to preserve her life.

It is my hope that my dear daughter will not take any action which would provoke a violent aggressor to murder her.

I want her home again, to heal, no matter what.

Spencer W. Kimball taught that I should be grateful to bury my daughter, and be happy that she fought to the death to preserve her virginity.

Spencer W. Kimball may or may not have been a monster. I don't know. I never met the man. But this 'teaching' of his is truly monstrous and supremely evil.
eschew obfuscation

"I'll let you believers in on a little secret: not only is the LDS church not really true, it's obviously not true." -Sethbag
_Some Schmo
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Re: The LDS Church is destructive dangerous.

Post by _Some Schmo »

The "masturbation leads to homosexuality" thing was a tip off that SWK was a closeted gay man. When he jerked off, he thought about men (as I imagine gay men do) and blamed those thoughts on touching himself when all along, he simply wanted men in the first place.

Poor, crazy old bastard. I really feel sorry for gay men in the closet.
God belief is for people who don't want to live life on the universe's terms.
_stemelbow
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Re: The LDS Church is destructive dangerous.

Post by _stemelbow »

I don't know what to say. I too think that virtue is extremely important in life. I don't see a reason as to drastically claim its more important than life itself, but obviously some will and actually think that. But all the quotes you offer do not state it quite like you guys do. I don't know why and I don't care. but I can't defend their comments to those who aren't going to try to summarize them correctly to begin with. So I shall take your explanations and move on for now.
Love ya tons,
Stem


I ain't nuttin'. don't get all worked up on account of me.
_Runtu
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Re: The LDS Church is destructive dangerous.

Post by _Runtu »

stemelbow wrote:I don't know what to say. I too think that virtue is extremely important in life. I don't see a reason as to drastically claim its more important than life itself, but obviously some will and actually think that. But all the quotes you offer do not state it quite like you guys do.


Here's beefcalf's original statement: "You don't think it's dangerous to teach young people that it is better to be DEAD than to lose their virginity before marriage?"

Here's one of the quotes from MoF: "Your virtue is worth more than your life. Please young folk, preserve your virtue even if you lose your lives."

And another from the same book: "There is no true Latter-day Saint who would not rather bury a son or daughter than to have him or her lose his or her chastity — realizing that chastity is of more value than anything else in all the world."

In what way do these quotes not say what beefcalf said they do?

I don't know why and I don't care. but I can't defend their comments to those who aren't going to try to summarize them correctly to begin with. So I shall take your explanations and move on for now.


So, how would you summarize them correctly? What exactly are we misrepresenting here? I would like to know.
Runtu's Rincón

If you just talk, I find that your mouth comes out with stuff. -- Karl Pilkington
_Eric

Re: The LDS Church is destructive dangerous.

Post by _Eric »

stemelbow = TAO ?
_Kevin Graham
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Re: The LDS Church is destructive dangerous.

Post by _Kevin Graham »

There is always potential for disapointment when people believe things that are untrue. The disappointment comes when one realizes they are no longer true. The problem with Mormonism is that it teaches not just teachings, but an entirely new worldview of reality in and of itself. Something more akin to a fairytale. It gives the membership a sense of purpose and identity. They feel more special than those who didn't do well enough in the preexistence to merit birth during the restoration. They are told they are immortal, that they will live forever. They feel all they have to do in this short life is obey Church leaders and they will progress eternally as Gods. Upon realization that the Church isn't "true" after all, this view of reality implodes, leaving some "apostates" in a very miserable situation. Some people handle it better than others, but the potential is certainly there. For me, I joined when I was 19 so I wasn't conditioned into the Mormon view of reality as a child, but I can imagine how tough it would be for those who were, especially when they are punished by the tribe for simply using their brains.

With some religions, finding out they are untrue is like getting lifted 5-10 feet off the ground before getting dropped to the ground leaving you with a sore behind for a week. With Mormonism it is like being lifted 50 feet off the ground (because you feel that much higher than the other "Gentiles") before being dropped on your arse upon discovering truth. Recovery from such injuries take longer, assuming the fall didn't kill you. Many Mormons avoid this by living in denial, continually convincing themselves that the truth is really just a trick played on us by Satan. The rest of us actually decide to give up the ghost, so to speak, and start relying on our brains.
_zeezrom
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Re: The LDS Church is destructive dangerous.

Post by _zeezrom »

Unless you have a very relaxed personality, yes.

I have a family member who grew up on the Islands and to him, church is really more about BYU football and hanging out with friends and family.
Oh for shame, how the mortals put the blame on us gods, for they say evils come from us, but it is they, rather, who by their own recklessness win sorrow beyond what is given... Zeus (1178 BC)

The Holy Sacrament.
_Runtu
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Re: The LDS Church is destructive dangerous.

Post by _Runtu »

zeezrom wrote:Unless you have a very relaxed personality, yes.

I have a family member who grew up on the Islands and to him, church is really more about BYU football and hanging out with friends and family.


A friend of mine says, "The LDS religion is a great way to raise your children ... if they're perfect. If they're not, not so much." Much wisdom there is in that.
Runtu's Rincón

If you just talk, I find that your mouth comes out with stuff. -- Karl Pilkington
_Kevin Graham
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Re: The LDS Church is destructive dangerous.

Post by _Kevin Graham »

One thing I learned after having kids is that the ole Mormon teaching about children being perfect is pure bunk. The spirit of Christ is in them? Children under eight are some of the most deceptive and conniving creatures ever put on this earth.
_Some Schmo
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Re: The LDS Church is destructive dangerous.

Post by _Some Schmo »

Kevin Graham wrote:One thing I learned after having kids is that the ole Mormon teaching about children being perfect is pure bunk. The spirit of Christ is in them? Children under eight are some of the most deceptive and conniving creatures ever put on this earth.

LOL... not to mention manipulative.
God belief is for people who don't want to live life on the universe's terms.
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