The List of Incongruence of COTPOTCOJCOLDS and the Book of Mormon

[_Spurven Ten Sing]

What is central to Mormonism is NOT Christ. That is central to all Christians. What is central to Mormonism is Christ + the new God, Joseph Smith. Smith is the difference.

Central does not equal what is different. central is the primary and most important teaching/concept. The most important concept to the LDS religion and people is Christ's atonement.

Nope. Let me show you the math.

Where C=Christ; J=Joseph Smith; G=God; M= Muhammad
G = Judaism
G+C = Christianity
G+C+M = Islam
G+C+J = Mormonism

Notice that G+C is never = Mormonism.
Nor does G = Mormonism
Nor G+C+M = Mormonism
The single factor to Mormonism is J.
You could also show G+J = Mormonism; C+J = Mormonism; J = Mormonism
...although the version of Mormonism changes.
Y
Thus the most important factor is J.

[_stemelbow]

I'm not quibbling, just trying to clarify my position. I do agree with you in part, just as I agree with Darth in part. I'm not sure why you aren't grasping that.

Here's the claim that DJ offered that I took issue with, "I think you will agree with me that the importance of the Book of Mormon in the modern LDS Church is not the Book of Mormon's substance, but its mere existence."

So does the Church find no amount of importance in the substance in the Book?

Thanks in advance for your answer.

[_stemelbow]

Nope. Let me show you the math.

Where C=Christ; J=Joseph Smith; G=God; M= Muhammad
G = Judaism
G+C = Christianity
G+C+M = Islam
G+C+J = Mormonism

Notice that G+C is never = Mormonism.
Nor does G = Mormonism
Nor G+C+M = Mormonism
The single factor to Mormonism is J.
You could also show G+J = Mormonism; C+J = Mormonism; J = Mormonism
...although the version of Mormonism changes.
Y
Thus the most important factor is J.

You're silly. What you consider the "most important factor" has nothing to do with what the religion itself, or those who adhere to it, see as the central point of the religion. You're missing the boat for the sake of argument. I don't care to run down that rabbit trail with you. Such was never my intent here.

[_stemelbow]

Nope. Let me show you the math.

Where C=Christ; J=Joseph Smith; G=God; M= Muhammad
G = Judaism
G+C = Christianity
G+C+M = Islam
G+C+J = Mormonism

Notice that G+C is never = Mormonism.
Nor does G = Mormonism
Nor G+C+M = Mormonism
The single factor to Mormonism is J.
You could also show G+J = Mormonism; C+J = Mormonism; J = Mormonism
...although the version of Mormonism changes.
Y
Thus the most important factor is J.

You're silly. What you consider the "most important factor" has nothing to do with what the religion itself, or those who adhere to it, see as the central point of the religion. You're missing the boat for the sake of argument. I don't care to run down that rabbit trail with you. Such was never my intent here.

[_Runtu]

Here's the claim that DJ offered that I took issue with, "I think you will agree with me that the importance of the Book of Mormon in the modern LDS Church is not the Book of Mormon's substance, but its mere existence."

So does the Church find no amount of importance in the substance in the Book?

Thanks in advance for your answer.

I have already answered that in that Darth's "claim" (hey, at least it's not an accusation anymore) is an overstatement. Obviously the church finds importance in the substance of the book, but its primary importance is as Darth said in its existence as a witness and conversion tool, not as an exposition of doctrine.

[_beefcalf]

Nope. Let me show you the math.

Where C=Christ; J=Joseph Smith; G=God; M= Muhammad
G = Judaism
G+C = Christianity
G+C+M = Islam
G+C+J = Mormonism

Notice that G+C is never = Mormonism.
Nor does G = Mormonism
Nor G+C+M = Mormonism
The single factor to Mormonism is J.
You could also show G+J = Mormonism; C+J = Mormonism; J = Mormonism
...although the version of Mormonism changes.
Y
Thus the most important factor is J.

You're silly. What you consider the "most important factor" has nothing to do with what the religion itself, or those who adhere to it, see as the central point of the religion. You're missing the boat for the sake of argument. I don't care to run down that rabbit trail with you. Such was never my intent here.

He's not silly.

Joseph Smith made the claim that Priesthood authority had been lost from the Earth during the great apostasy ~60 AD.

Smith claimed that he was the first to be given the priesthood in the latter-days. All Priesthood authority claimed by the modern church is based on this claim.

No Joseph Smith = No Mormon Church. STS is correct.

[_stemelbow]

He's not silly.

Joseph Smith made the claim that Priesthood authority had been lost from the Earth during the great apostasy ~60 AD.

Smith claimed that he was the first to be given the priesthood in the latter-days. All Priesthood authority claimed by the modern church is based on this claim.

No Joseph Smith = No Mormon Church. STS is correct.

Sure he's silly, the things that caused the Church's existence is not my point here. His is a strawman. My point was what is central in the LDS view to the religious teachings of the Church. the central teaching, that which all else is contigent upon is the atonement of Christ. Without the atonement, or its teaching, there would have been no Joseph Smith, restoration, priesthood or nothing.

[_stemelbow]

Here's the claim that DJ offered that I took issue with, "I think you will agree with me that the importance of the Book of Mormon in the modern LDS Church is not the Book of Mormon's substance, but its mere existence."

So does the Church find no amount of importance in the substance in the Book?

Thanks in advance for your answer.

I have already answered that in that Darth's "claim" (hey, at least it's not an accusation anymore) is an overstatement. Obviously the church finds importance in the substance of the book, but its primary importance is as Darth said in its existence as a witness and conversion tool, not as an exposition of doctrine.

DJ didn't say its primary importance, but its only importance to the Church is in its existence. Its yes or no, not overstate or not. Oh well...Can't get some straight shooting from old Runtu. I guess I better just pack it in and let it go.

[_Runtu]

DJ didn't say its primary importance, but its only importance to the Church is in its existence. Its yes or no, not overstate or not. Oh well...Can't get some straight shooting from old Runtu. I guess I better just pack it in and let it go.

I have explained my opinion over and over to you. How is that not "straight shooting"? It's really tiresome to have someone imply I'm being deceptive when I'm simply trying to clarify what I think.

[_beefcalf]

He's not silly.

Joseph Smith made the claim that Priesthood authority had been lost from the Earth during the great apostasy ~60 AD.

Smith claimed that he was the first to be given the priesthood in the latter-days. All Priesthood authority claimed by the modern church is based on this claim.

No Joseph Smith = No Mormon Church. STS is correct.

Sure he's silly, the things that caused the Church's existence is not my point here. His is a strawman. My point was what is central in the LDS view to the religious teachings of the Church. the central teaching, that which all else is contigent upon is the atonement of Christ. Without the atonement, or its teaching, there would have been no Joseph Smith, restoration, priesthood or nothing.

Exactly. The Atonement.

Which is the exact same central belief in all ten-thousand sects of Christianity.

His point is: 'What is unique about the LDS religion?' Answer: Joseph Smith.

EVERY OTHER CHRISTIAN SECT has the atonement. Only the Latter-Day Saint movement, the Brighamites in particular, look to Smith as their prophet.