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Over at MDDB, discussions about the Book of Mormon Musical have centered on misstatements in the musical. I was once again reminded of how often the things I grew up believing are considered by TBMs to be distortions and lies now when raised by outsiders. So, with that in mind, do you think it's wrong for active LDS to believe any of the following claims (feel free to add others)?

-Is the member who sings the hymn "If I Could Hie to Kolob" mistaken in thinking Kolob is a planet?

- Humankind has the potential to become gods and goddesses who will rule over planets in the hereafter.

- Jesus, as a perfect, resurrected being, will rule over planets.

- Jesus' visit to the Americas occurred in what is now the United States.

- Ancient Jews (Mulek, anyone) built boats and sailed to the Americas.

Wait,

Those items in your list are all part of Mormonism. We all believed these.

Maybe it's best to paste the song lyrics for "I Believe" and ask whether there's anything in them that would be odd for a 19-year old missionary to believe. Even the "Mormon just believes" rings true in the sense that we were told to preach first, and the testimony will come.

Ever since I was a child
I tried to be the best
So what happened?

My family and friends
All said I was blessed
So what happened?

It was supposed to be all so exciting
To be teaching of Christ across the sea
But I allowed my faith to be shaken
Oh, what's the matter with me?

I've always longed to help the needy
To do the things I never dared
This was the time for me to step up
So then why was I so scared?

A warlord who shoots people in the face
What's so scary about that?

I must trust that my Lord is mightier
And always has my back
Now I must be completely devout
I can't have even one shred of doubt

I believe that the Lord God created the universe
I believe that He sent His only Son to die for my sins
And I believe that ancient Jews built boats and sailed to America
I am a Mormon
And a Mormon just believes

You cannot just believe partway
You have to believe in it all
My problem was doubting the Lord's will
Instead of standing tall

I can't allow myself to have any doubt
It's time to set my worries free
Time to show the world what Elder Price is about
And share the power inside of me

I believe that God has a plan for all of us
I believe that plan involves me getting my own planet
And I believe that the current President of the Church, Thomas Monson, speaks directly to God
I am a Mormon
And dangit, a Mormon just believes

I know that I must go and do
The things my God commands
I realize now why He sent me here

If you ask the Lord in faith
He will always answer you
Just believe in Him and have no fear

(General, we have an intruder. He just walked right into camp.) [WALKS INTO WARLORD'S CAMP]

I believe that Satan has ahold of you
I believe that the Lord God has sent me here
And I believe that in 1978 God changed His mind about black people
You can be a Mormon
A Mormon who just believes

(What the “F” is this?) [WARLORD]

And now I can feel the excitement
This is the moment I was born to do
And I feel so incredible
To be sharing my faith with you

The scriptures say that if you ask in faith
If you ask God Himself, you'll know
But you must ask Him without any doubt
And let your spirit grow

I believe that God lives on a planet called Kolob
I believe that Jesus has His own planet as well
And I believe that the Garden of Eden was in Jackson County, Missouri

If you believe, the Lord will reveal it
And you'll know it's all true, you'll just feel it

You'll be a Mormon
And, by gosh, a Mormon just believes

I believe

Frankly, none of those points are of the temple recommend variety. I suppose people can quibble about the details, like is Kolob a planet or star, or both, but its all fairly meaningless to the average believer. In other words, you are right any LDS can believe any of the above. Its no big deal.

I believed all those things when I was a believing Mormon, (such a long time ago that I really don't want to mention numbers).

I believed that Jesus visited North America, that Cumorah was in New York (more than one? Huh?), that the Nephites found an empty continent (except for remnant of the Jaredites), etc. It threatens my inner peace when I see apologists or the uninformed say those things were never taught.

I was talking recently to a person who experienced the church very much the same way I did, the same age, same ward, same BYU education, etc. The difference is, she is still a devout member. She is not an internet Mormon. She believes that the Nephites came to an empty continent (empty of people, that is, of course), that Cumorah is in New York, that Missouri is Zion because the Nephites lived there. She has been Relief Society pres and seminary teacher, but she was a little wobbly on Book of Mormon issues, she was trying to remember something she'd heard about Central America, and it was obvious that she is basically unconcerned and uninformed of apologetic theories. She's a busy woman.

She said maybe someday science could prove with DNA who the ancestors of the NA's are. I said it was already being done and there was no sign of Hebrew ancestry. She was a little taken aback by that, and said it was her theory that Native peoples like Navajos and Eskimos (who look Asian)came across the land bridge, but of course, that was many years [b]after the Nephites arrived.[/b] I didn't have the heart to take it much further than that.

p.s. It's pretty funny to see TBMs quibble over the planet/star thing.

Stem,

Deification is not some little detail but rather sitting in the core of Mormonism.

zeezrom wrote:Stem,

Deification is not some little detail but rather sitting in the core of Mormonism.

kinda...but I can see people taking issue with the "ruling over planets" thing, in a quibbling sort of way. I guess it is that I also feel any LDS can reject deification if he/she wants on some ground or other. There's some wiggle room there.

core in the religion is really Jesus Christ and Him crucified. many an LDS won't, as it is often said, be those actually "deified".

Nope it's not wrong at all. If you didn't believe in these things the tbm's I know would think your kind of a strange. As ironic as that sound :)

stemelbow wrote:Frankly, none of those points are of the temple recommend variety. I suppose people can quibble about the details, like is Kolob a planet or star, or both, but its all fairly meaningless to the average believer. In other words, you are right any LDS can believe any of the above. Its no big deal.

Yeah, all of Mormonism is fairly meaningless, to the ex-Mos as well as the average believer. Mormonism being no big deal? I agree with that too.

Baker wrote:-Is the member who sings the hymn "If I Could Hie to Kolob" mistaken in thinking Kolob is a planet?

Yes, they should read Abraham to correct themselves.

- Humankind has the potential to become gods and goddesses who will rule over planets in the hereafter.

Nope, that's true.

- Jesus, as a perfect, resurrected being, will rule over planets.

Accurate.

- Jesus' visit to the Americas occurred in what is now the United States.

Possible, no problem with that.

- Ancient Jews (Mulek, anyone) built boats and sailed to the Americas.

More likely they hired or bought boats.