DiscussMormonism.com

http://www.ksl.com/?nid=148&sid=15972981

Where is l-dsinc leadership in all this?

Will l-dsince refund their tithing since they were criminals and liars?

What is wrong with tubbietommie that this crap happens and he does not stand up as a leader and get involved personally to make things right?

"Families can be together forever"... if they follow dad to Guatamala or El Salvador?

Why does Joseph want the LDS church to become an arm of INS?

Maybe it isn't doctrine. Might just be a flick of history or something l-dsinc doesn't know anything about but the statements below might have some kind of meaning to some Mormons.

12. We believe in being subject to kings, presidents, rulers, and magistrates, in obeying, honoring, and sustaining the law.

13. We believe in being honest

Joseph wrote:Maybe it isn't doctrine. Might just be a flick of history or something l-dsinc doesn't know anything about but the statements below might have some kind of meaning to some Mormons.

12. We believe in being subject to kings, presidents, rulers, and magistrates, in obeying, honoring, and sustaining the law.

13. We believe in being honest

So by that you assume that LDS should also enforce the law and discriminate based on legal status they have no way of confirming?

In other words you want the Church to operate as a branch of INS.

The Nehor wrote:

Joseph wrote:Maybe it isn't doctrine. Might just be a flick of history or something l-dsinc doesn't know anything about but the statements below might have some kind of meaning to some Mormons.

12. We believe in being subject to kings, presidents, rulers, and magistrates, in obeying, honoring, and sustaining the law.

13. We believe in being honest

So by that you assume that LDS should also enforce the law and discriminate based on legal status they have no way of confirming?

In other words you want the Church to operate as a branch of INS.

Nope.
I want the Church to uphold the standards and claims that they state rather than time and time again being caught out in hypocrisy. Those Bishops will have asked every one of their flock who attended a Temple Recommend interview 'are you honest in your dealings with your fellow men?'. Hypocrites.

I'd also like an explanation as to the Holy Ghosts whereabouts during the interview with the Stake President when these people were appointed Bishops...

jon wrote:Nope.
I want the Church to uphold the standards and claims that they state rather than time and time again being caught out in hypocrisy.

So you want to explain what our standards mean and then hold us to them? We call that a strawman argument.

Those Bishops will have asked every one of their flock who attended a Temple Recommend interview 'are you honest in your dealings with your fellow men?'. Hypocrites.

Honesty means obeying every secular law at all times?

You seriously believe this?

I'd also like an explanation as to the Holy Ghosts whereabouts during the interview with the Stake President when these people were appointed Bishops...

First, branch presidents are not bishops.

Secondly, probably saying they would be a good branch president. From all I know they were. Good for them.

Nehor,

I think the standard of 'we believe in being honest...' does not need a straw man from me or anyone else. The recommend question 'Are you honest in your dealings with your fellow men?' likewise is self explanatory.

However, let's see if David Bednar (quoting Faust) can help you with a more official take on what honesty means:
Honesty is the quality or condition of being truthful, sincere, candid, and worthy of honor. The word honesty is related to other words with the same root such as honor and honorable These expressions share the notion of being genuine, trustworthy, upright, respectable, and decent. As President James E. Faust, Second Counselor in the First Presidency, has taught: “We all need to know what it means to be honest. Honesty is more than not lying. It is truth telling, truth speaking, truth living, and truth loving.”

I may be mistaken but it seems to me that you believe that being dishonest is okay sometimes. Perhaps you don't understand or don't live the standards on honesty that the Church, Mr Bednar and Mr Faust say you should...

jon wrote:Nehor,

I think the standard of 'we believe in being honest...' does not need a straw man from me or anyone else. The recommend question 'Are you honest in your dealings with your fellow men?' likewise is self explanatory.

I agree.

However, let's see if David Bednar (quoting Faust) can help you with a more official take on what honesty means:
Honesty is the quality or condition of being truthful, sincere, candid, and worthy of honor. The word honesty is related to other words with the same root such as honor and honorable These expressions share the notion of being genuine, trustworthy, upright, respectable, and decent. As President James E. Faust, Second Counselor in the First Presidency, has taught: “We all need to know what it means to be honest. Honesty is more than not lying. It is truth telling, truth speaking, truth living, and truth loving.”

Well said. Faust, not you.

I may be mistaken but it seems to me that you believe that being dishonest is okay sometimes. Perhaps you don't understand or don't live the standards on honesty that the Church, Mr Bednar and Mr Faust say you should...

How is crossing a border being 'dishonest to my fellow men'?

Nehor,

Are they being deported simply because they crossed a border like most people do when they go on holiday or on business trips etc or because they crossed that border under false pretences and took up illegal residence?

jon wrote:Nehor,

Are they being deported simply because they crossed a border like most people do when they go on holiday or on business trips etc or because they crossed that border under false pretences and took up illegal residence?

What false pretense?