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The Church finally turning to the Apologists for help

Posted: Thu Aug 18, 2011 3:38 am
by _daheshism
While I was LDS (1980 to 1989) I tried many times to get the Church to open a "Office" to handle Members, Missionaries, and Investigators who had anti-Mormon questions. Not to debate, but to answer truthfully sincere concerns from members, missionaries, and investigators. This office would be staffed with people who knew most of the answers. I was willing to train the staff myself. I was willing to work in that office too, for 12,000 a year. Full time.

Well, basically I was told:
1) "If the Brethren would have wanted this, it would it come to them via a Revelation" (comment: The Brethren don't get any Revelations!)

2) "Faithful Members NEVER have any questions. If you have questions it is only because you're not living the Gospel and have secret unrepentent sins."

3) "Who cares if the Church loses tens of thousands of investigators each year because of anti-Mormon literature! The Church is growing by leaps and bounds. We don't need them!"

I wrote to the First Presidency about this first, I think, in 1981. I told them the following:

1. If you don't address the anti-Mormon problem, it wil only grow.
2. A sincere investigator who becomes a detractor because of anti-Mormon literature, becomes in essence a "convert" to the anti-Mormons.
3. Eventually, North America will become saturated with anti-Mormon "converts", and the missionaries will find it more and more difficult to make converts to the Church, because of the MASSIVE number of anti-Mormon converts.
4. Much of this can be averted if the missionaries had a 800 number they could give to investigators, and even use themselves, to "counsel" with sincere investigators and missionaries with anti-Mormon questions.

Anyway, of course, I was told that I was "trying to stead the Ark" and "trying to fool the Brethren" and "not living the Gospel" and I had "some secret agenda" that was dark and evil. But, the Brethren are beginning to SEE THE LIGHT and notice that convert baptisms in the U.S. are drying up! That's why they've given a SECRET "green light" for FAIR to start handing anti-Mormon questions from the Media.

Once again, it takes The Brethren about 30 years to finally accept FACTS. Like the FACT that using the full name of the Church, and not using "Mormon", means NOTHING! The Brethren really believed for decades that if you simply used the Church's full name, and not used "Mormon", then Christians will think: "Wow, it's the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints". Golly, they really must be Christians after all!"

Of course, as usual, NOTHING could be further than the TRUTH!!! The Brethren are easily fooled, easily duped. Using the Church's full name convinced about 00000000000000000000.1 % of Evangelicals that the Church was Christian! It convinced a LOT MORE Evangelicals that the Church is DECEPTIVE.

Oh, Dear Brethren, you're about 20 years too late! The United States is now saturated with "anti-Mormon converts"; all because you swept it all under the rug, and didn't do anything about it when you had the opportunity. Serves you right. You are, Dear Brethren, about as "inspired of God" as my LEFT NUT, and I don't have a LEFT NUT!

Re: The Church finally turning to the Apologists for help

Posted: Thu Aug 18, 2011 3:48 am
by _Morley
daheshism wrote:While I was LDS (1980 to 1989) I tried many times to get the Church to open a "Office" to handle Members, Missionaries, and Investigators who had anti-Mormon questions. Not to debate, but to answer truthfully sincere concerns from members, missionaries, and investigators. This office would be staffed with people who knew most of the answers. I was willing to train the staff myself. I was willing to work in that office too, for 12,000 a year. Full time.

Well, basically I was told:
1) "If the Brethren would have wanted this, it would it come to them via a Revelation" (comment: The Brethren don't get any Revelations!)

2) "Faithful Members NEVER have any questions. If you have questions it is only because you're not living the Gospel and have secret unrepentent sins."

3) "Who cares if the Church loses tens of thousands of investigators each year because of anti-Mormon literature! The Church is growing by leaps and bounds. We don't need them!"

I wrote to the First Presidency about this first, I think, in 1981. I told them the following:

1. If you don't address the anti-Mormon problem, it wil only grow.
2. A sincere investigator who becomes a detractor because of anti-Mormon literature, becomes in essence a "convert" to the anti-Mormons.
3. Eventually, North America will become saturated with anti-Mormon "converts", and the missionaries will find it more and more difficult to make converts to the Church, because of the MASSIVE number of anti-Mormon converts.
4. Much of this can be averted if the missionaries had a 800 number they could give to investigators, and even use themselves, to "counsel" with sincere investigators and missionaries with anti-Mormon questions.

Anyway, of course, I was told that I was "trying to stead the Ark" and "trying to fool the Brethren" and "not living the Gospel" and I had "some secret agenda" that was dark and evil. But, the Brethren are beginning to SEE THE LIGHT and notice that convert baptisms in the U.S. are drying up! That's why they've given a SECRET "green light" for FAIR to start handing anti-Mormon questions from the Media.

Once again, it takes The Brethren about 30 years to finally accept FACTS. Like the FACT that using the full name of the Church, and not using "Mormon", means NOTHING! The Brethren really believed for decades that if you simply used the Church's full name, and not used "Mormon", then Christians will think: "Wow, it's the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints". Golly, they really must be Christians after all!"

Of course, as usual, NOTHING could be further than the TRUTH!!! The Brethren are easily fooled, easily duped. Using the Church's full name convinced about 00000000000000000000.1 % of Evangelicals that the Church was Christian! It convinced a LOT MORE Evangelicals that the Church is DECEPTIVE.

Oh, Dear Brethren, you're about 20 years too late! The United States is now saturated with "anti-Mormon converts"; all because you swept it all under the rug, and didn't do anything about it when you had the opportunity. Serves you right. You are, Dear Brethren, about as "inspired of God" as my LEFT NUT, and I don't have a LEFT NUT!
My emphasis.

Derek, how is 00000000000000000000.1 % any different from 0.1%--or one tenth of one percent? And good luck with that whole left nut thing.

(God help me and my sorry-assed compulsion to read your posts.)

Re: The Church finally turning to the Apologists for help

Posted: Thu Aug 18, 2011 6:17 am
by _Dr. Shades
daheshism wrote:You are, Dear Brethren, about as "inspired of God" as my LEFT NUT, and I don't have a LEFT NUT!

What happened to it?

Re: The Church finally turning to the Apologists for help

Posted: Thu Aug 18, 2011 7:00 am
by _bcspace
and I don't have a LEFT NUT!


What do you have? A left pea?