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Cult is a four letter word and can also be a hate word. Hang the word cult member on somebody and you have already pegged them as lesser than you.

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I, for one, think that the label of "cult" does not fit the LDS church. The argument may have made sense in Joseph Smith's days or in Brigham Young's days, but not now.

I'm guessing this is a response to one of Perry's supporter's calling the LDS church a cult. There will always be people making accusations like that. Similar people call the Catholic church a cult, and I am certain that there is far more dissent (obviously not allowed in a cult) in the Catholic church than in the LDS one. What I mean by all of this is that it is an extremist view and I disagree.

Other four letter words:

- lord
- give
- fast
- know
- pray
- talk
- heal
- hymn
- obey

I suppose we should avoid these potential hate words too.

Some Schmo wrote:Other four letter words:

- lord
- give
- fast
- know
- pray
- talk
- heal
- hymn
- obey

I suppose we should avoid these potential hate words too.

Not one of those words is used as a put down. Generating religious hatred as a political ploy only shows how low some self-righteous folk will sink.

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moksha wrote:

Some Schmo wrote:Other four letter words:

- lord
- give
- fast
- know
- pray
- talk
- heal
- hymn
- obey

I suppose we should avoid these potential hate words too.

Not one of those words is used as a put down. Generating religious hatred as a political ploy only shows how low some self-righteous folk will sink.

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They may not be used as put down, but they are used to control. Every single one of them disgusts me in the realm of Mormonism. Because Mormonism bastardized them, convoluted them, corrupted them. All of them are used to manipulate and control.

It takes years after leaving Mormonism to re-learn those words. To find new meaning in them. To understand that they can exist without strings attached.

Yes, Mormonism was a cult I was in.

Cult is a four letter word and can also be a hate word. Hang the word cult member on somebody and you have already pegged them as lesser than you.

I enjoy reminding people of the old standard definitions of cult under which all of Christianity falls.

moksha wrote: Generating religious hatred as a political ploy only shows how low some self-righteous folk will sink.

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Maybe they think LDS actually is a cult? Actually, you are just as intolerant as they are - ah, the beauty of tolerance. It makes sinners of all of us.

Sure, nobody wants the word "cult" applied to their organization, as the word has negative connotations.

I wonder, though, if the people who object to the application of the word to their organization would, at least, admit that there exist some organizations that are deserving of the title.

I think it's a good direction to take the discussion when such people object. "But you do agree that cults exist, right? What's an example of a cult that you can think of? What makes that organization a cult? Why is that a cult, but your organization isn't?"

Either they will identify groups that they believe are cults, or they'll be dishonest and say that no cults exist.

moksha wrote:Cult is a four letter word and can also be a hate word. Hang the word cult member on somebody and you have already pegged them as lesser than you.

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I agree, Moksha, the way words get used can cause them to become emotionally-laden in ways that their denoted definitions do not include, to the point those definitions are in fact changed with time.

Merriam-Webster defines cult this way (I've underlined those portions I think do apply to Mormonism:

1 : formal religious veneration : WORSHIP
2 : a system of religious beliefs and ritual; also : its body of adherents
3 : a religion regarded as unorthodox or spurious; also : its body of adherents
4 : a system for the cure of disease based on dogma set forth by its promulgator <health cults>
5 a : great devotion to a person, idea, object, movement, or work (as a film or book); especially : such devotion regarded as a literary or intellectual fad
b : the object of such devotion
c : a usually small group of people characterized by such devotion

I think when Mormons bristle at the suggestion that their religion is a cult, they are focusing almost entirely on #5, and #5 c in particular. Mormonism is not a small group; it numbers in the millions.

The Mormon religion obviously fits ##1 and2, as it is a formal religious veneration, i.e. worship, and a system of beliefs and rituals.

The context this past week that Mormonism was publicly labeled a 'cult' seems to fit the #3 definition, because Mormonism is quite unorthodox as compared to traditional Christianity in the world. The nature of god as having a physical body like man's and the godhead being three distinct and separate entities, albeit with a singular purpose, is quite unorthodox.

#4 seems to be an application of the word 'cult' that does not fit Mormonism.

As to #5 a (and b, for that matter), Mormons exhibit a great devotion to Joseph Smith and successor general authorities, particularly it's 'prophets'. Mormons exhibit a great devotion to the Book of Mormon, the D&C and the PoGP, and the ideas contained therein.

So I think given the multi-faceted definition of the word, 'cult', and as Rick Perry's support applied it to Mormonism, I think it was a fair use.

Kittens_and_Jesus wrote: I am certain that there is far more dissent (obviously not allowed in a cult) in the Catholic church than in the LDS one. What I mean by all of this is that it is an extremist view and I disagree.

What level of dissent is allowed in the LDS cult?

Joseph Smith did NOT restore a "cult".

Mormon History: William Clayton's Journal

-- Apr 8, 1843
Nauvoo, Illinois. Joseph Smith asked the congregation to pray to calm the winds while he spoke to them at the morning session of conference. (2)

Joseph Smith preaches concerning the Nauvoo high council trial of Pelatiah Brown, Sr.: "I do not like the old man being called up for erring in doctrine. It looks too much like the Methodist[s], and not like the Latter-day Saints. Methodists have creeds which a man must believe or be asked out of their church. I want the liberty of thinking and believing as I please. It feels so good not to be trammelled. It does not prove that a man is not a good man because he errs in doctrine."

It is telling of the LDS Cult that all acceptable thinking is done by the Apostles and Prophets duly called and sustained. To think otherwise is immediate cause for shunning, in the hearts of the members and eventual formal cult discipline. Which is a the most transparent evidence of cult-think such auto-reaction exhibited by all cults when the absolute authority of the cult head is diminished, questioned, challenged, corrected or repudiated.

So long as Satan sits in the hearts of cowards who have not the virtue in their priesthood to allow men the liberty of thinking untrammeled, who do not trust in the Lord to lead by the power of the Spirit, (because they have lost the key of knowledge and do not know how to teach the people how to get in at the door and stand upon the rock of Christ wherein they are harnessed, pulling in the traces, having taken the bit in their teeth whereby a citizen in the real kingdom of God ARE and can be led by the Spirit) and think it best to control and interrupt a free relationship with God, which is the inalienable right of all flesh, and take carnal measures to enforce conformity a cult is all that the LDS Church will ever be.