DiscussMormonism.com

I'm going to sincerely try to move on from yesterday's debacle that many witnessed. I know you all, or most of you, disagreed with me anyway (boohoo). Most posters here are all sweet and nice and are willing to avoid the complaining about LDS folks and prefer to stick to the subject (yeah right). Anyway...

I'll be interested in the thoughts I get...

If you think of it in terms of individuals...in terms of personalities...in terms of viewpoints...in terms of living breathing loving souls, this world is just so large. There is so much out there. So many ideas...so many perspectives...so many desires...and wants...and actual relationships.

Yep. Relationships. I just realize more and more that relationships are by and large our purpose in life. The second greatest commandment, afterall, is to love each other.

As I read the words of the Savior during His time in Gethseman I'm encouraged that my view is supported. In the end, He plead that His followers can be one or united as The Son and The Father are. His hope, his dying wish, was that there would be unity. Without love, without relationships there is no unity. To me, even more than sacrificing for sin, this is atonement. Surely we could figure out some way to get along and associate without the atonement, but could we really get over all the personal quibbles and all the personal assaults without it? I don't think so. Atonement adds such depth, and such meaning to unity I daresay there is nothing greater.

Jesus had to give to us. He had to go through the pains and sufferings of mankind in every way in order to be able to give to us. In order to be able to know what it will take for unity. At some point we simply can't comprehend the very diverse ideas and opinions that exist among the world's inhabitants. But to add to the unfathomable possibility, we simply can't do the same for all the inhabitants that ever lived. The amount of perspective and paradigms is just too great. its just all too far beyond us.

I suppose with that said, it'd be much easier to just assume there is no Savior. There is no life after death. There is no God. I just can't do that for many reasons, but one such reason is because on such a view of atheism, there is no potential, eternal, nearly all-encompassing, nor as diverse a unity possible. Things become far more dreadful to me. That's of course not so say that atheists don't have things to live for or that they are anymore less happy or healthy than religionists.

Please pardon my weak ability to explain myself and lets move forward discussing this if you please.

stemelbow wrote:
I suppose with that said, it'd be much easier to just assume there is no Savior. There is no life after death. There is no God.

I think it is more comforting to say that there is life after death but that is just a hope for many humans. In reality there is most likely not and that is hard to say because it scares the crap out of many people.

I just can't do that for many reasons, but one such reason is because on such a view of atheism, there is no potential, eternal, nearly all-encompassing, nor as diverse a unity possible. Things become far more dreadful to me.

See it scares the crap out of you. That's why it is hard for you to say that there is no God or life after death. You really hope there is. Yeah the truth can hurt.

by the way I think Jesus was full of himself.

Rambo wrote:See it scares the s*** out of you. That's why it is hard for you to say that there is no God or life after death. You really hope there is. Yeah the truth can hurt.

by the way I think Jesus was full of himself.

I don't know if its scarey at all. What's scarey about everything just ending at death?

What encourages me in my faith is, though, the great potential it offers. There is nothing sweeter in my mind. Sadly atheism itself can't offer anything near that level of goodness and hope and wonder and love.

Pep pep on the Jesus is full of himself--seeing how being full of oneself is a prerequisite for posting here (I couldn't help adding my own little snide remark. I figured its fair since you did and we can do it with no sense of hostility I hope.)

So what does this mean?

Things become far more dreadful to me.

That sounds like fear of something.

I walk by a church sign everyday that says no one can come unto the father except by me Jesus Christ.
That sounds like someone who is full of himself. Actually it's just about the top comments of someone that would be full of themselves.

Well I'm sure there are some people here that are full of themselves as well. I don't think they can top Jesus though.

Rambo wrote:So what does this mean?

Things become far more dreadful to me.

That sounds like fear of something.

Sounds like hoplessness to me. I suppose that can breed fear but its not fear. They are two different things.

I walk by a church sign everyday that says no one can come unto the father except by me Jesus Christ.
That sounds like someone who is full of himself. Actually it's just about the top comments of someone that would be full of themselves.

Well I'm sure there are some people here that are full of themselves as well. I don't think they can top Jesus though.

That's some more goofy thinking, Rambo. (meant playfully of course). I tend to think there are some here who seem to reach the pinnacle of full of him/herself. I won't name names though. I'm just saying how ironic that comment sounds.

See it scares the s*** out of you. That's why it is hard for you to say that there is no God or life after death. You really hope there is. Yeah the truth can hurt.

Yet you don't actually know there is no God but have merely accepted such as fact and resigned yourself to your fate.

stemelbow wrote:
I suppose with that said, it'd be much easier to just assume there is no Savior. There is no life after death. There is no God. I just can't do that for many reasons, but one such reason is because on such a view of atheism, there is no potential, eternal, nearly all-encompassing, nor as diverse a unity possible. Things become far more dreadful to me. That's of course not so say that atheists don't have things to live for or that they are anymore less happy or healthy than religionists.

Please pardon my weak ability to explain myself and lets move forward discussing this if you please.

When it first occurred to me that there might not be any god, it was a dreadful experience for me too. You get over it. It only seems dreadful when you've spent your life with the expectation of a paternal god and an afterlife. It's very disappointing at first. But reality actually isn't so bad. In some ways it's a lot better.

bcspace wrote:

See it scares the s*** out of you. That's why it is hard for you to say that there is no God or life after death. You really hope there is. Yeah the truth can hurt.

Yet you don't actually know there is no God but have merely accepted such as fact and resigned yourself to your fate.

You don't know there is a God but you will tell yourself you know and you have resigned yourself to the fate of giving you time and money to a church.

stemelbow wrote:Sadly atheism itself can't offer anything near that level of goodness and hope and wonder and love.

in my opinion atheism makes you appreciate your life better, and live life more fully. Instead of doing everything in the context of preparing for an imaginary afterlife, you have the perspective of every moment in your life being precious and irreplacable. It's simple economics - scarcity drives up value. If you think you're going to live forever, each day you have is less valuable because there is an infinite number of them. Just like a dollar is less important to a millionaire (or someone who thinks he's a millionaire) than to a homeless man.

You also appreciate your family more, for the same reason - you have less time with them. At least, it made ME appreciate them more.

Buffalo wrote:
in my opinion atheism makes you appreciate your life better, and live life more fully. Instead of doing everything in the context of preparing for an imaginary afterlife, you have the perspective of every moment in your life being precious and irreplacable. It's simple economics - scarcity drives up value. If you think you're going to live forever, each day you have is less valuable because there is an infinite number of them. Just like a dollar is less important to a millionaire (or someone who thinks he's a millionaire) than to a homeless man.

You also appreciate your family more, for the same reason - you have less time with them. At least, it made ME appreciate them more.

This is what I noticed as well Buffalo. When I use to believe in a after life I wouldn't understand the people that would say life is short. I would always think to myself so what if life is short, we are going to live forever. I had no fear of death either cause if I died young then I would still be alive in the next life so it wouldn't really matter. Sure I would miss my family but I would see them shortly. Seriously what is 80 years when you have all eternity. Thinking you live forever really diminished the value of this life in my opinion.