DiscussMormonism.com

Last night, I watched 2 Lifetime movies about polygamy. I suppose it had me mulling over some things regarding how Mormonism has evolved into the modern era.

If polygamy had never been declared illegal, what do you think that today's LDS Church in the 21st century would look like?

I would like to hear comments before voicing my opinion. Frankly, I am not exactly sure myself, and would like to hear from others.

Thanks for contributing!

Is your question meant to imply that the LDS church of today would still be practicing polygamy? Because if nothing else was different, other than it was not declared illegal, then I think the Church would have abandoned it eventually anyways due to the social pressures. The biggest change I think we would see is a present day FLDS that was much larger and more open, perhaps one that was even proselytizing.

Fence Sitter wrote:Is your question meant to imply that the LDS church of today would still be practicing polygamy? Because if nothing else was different, other than it was not declared illegal, then I think the Church would have abandoned it eventually anyways due to the social pressures. The biggest change I think we would see is a present day FLDS that was much larger and more open, perhaps one that was even proselytizing.

So you think that if polygamy was still legal...that it was never deemed illegal, that the Church would have still abolished the practice? Interesting.

Why do you feel that way? Is it based on the other states that were primarily against it?

liz3564 wrote:Last night, I watched 2 Lifetime movies about polygamy. I suppose it had me mulling over some things regarding how Mormonism has evolved into the modern era.

If polygamy had never been declared illegal, what do you think that today's LDS Church in the 21st century would look like?

I would like to hear comments before voicing my opinion. Frankly, I am not exactly sure myself, and would like to hear from others.

Thanks for contributing!

I think it's safe to say that the church would never have gotten rid of polygamy. If Utah had been granted statehood, without being forced on the polygamy issue, the LDS church would still be practicing polygamy today.

My guess is that the LDS church would be somewhat bigger than the current FLDS church, with a mid to high 6 digit membership. It would be almost entirely restricted to Utah, southern Idaho, and maybe small enclaves in Southern Canada and Northern Arizona. There would be the odd polygamist Mormon family living elsewhere, but they would be very rare. Their reputation would be exactly that of the current FLDS church, they would be perceived as complete wackos.

From a social/political perspective here's what would be different in the LDS church.

1) The church would exert minimal to no influence in Utah State politics. The numbers simply would not warrant much influence. I also think that most members would be apolitical or would split their vote much more often than they do now.

2) The LDS church would be much more apocalyptic. The complete failure of the LDS missionary program would be forcefully interpreted as a "Sign of the Times," that the world is ripe with sin and ready to be burned. This would also feed into many LDS members being apolitical (if the end is near, why vote?)

3) The LDS church would be a massive drain on the social, welfare, and police system of Utah and the small enclaves in other states. For this reason alone the church would accrue massive negative perceptions. The number of lost boys produced by the LDS church would be astronomical, leading to a massive drain on social/police services. There would also be the constant calls to sort out problems of child brides and spousal neglect/abuse.

4) I think there is a good chance that the priesthood ban would still be in effect. If you are already isolated, looked down upon, and have no prospects for outside converts, getting rid of a policy that is negatively perceived is just not that important.

5) The kookier Mormon doctrines, such as Adam-God, would still be thriving. Again, why distance yourself from crazy ideas which keep people from joining your church if there is little prospect of them joining anyway?

6) Prop 8 would never have happened, nor for that matter Prop 22.

liz3564 wrote:

Fence Sitter wrote:Is your question meant to imply that the LDS church of today would still be practicing polygamy? Because if nothing else was different, other than it was not declared illegal, then I think the Church would have abandoned it eventually anyways due to the social pressures. The biggest change I think we would see is a present day FLDS that was much larger and more open, perhaps one that was even proselytizing.

So you think that if polygamy was still legal...that it was never deemed illegal, that the Church would have still abolished the practice? Interesting.

Why do you feel that way? Is it based on the other states that were primarily against it?

So many factors one has to assume to project a scenario. I think AS makes a good case above for what it might look like today had it remained legal and part of the Church. My guess is based on nothing else changing besides it being unlawful and the expectation that social pressures to abandon polygamy would continue to mount on all sides, even from within. Eventually the Church would see no other option but to repeal it, similar to the blacks in the priesthood issue. Perhaps that would have been done in steps where it was discontinued here in the US but allowed in Mexico. As more and more leaders stopped practicing it eventually it would be discontinued altogether. You might even see a FLDS church that would be the same size as the non polygamous version. I do agree with AS in that the size and influence of the Church would be greatly reduced.

I am not sure I would project a FLDS version quite as extreme as AS because I think they too would be influenced by outside social pressures, though not as much as the non polygamous version. Today I think they would be doing everything they could to fit in and be accepted as normal while at the same time complaining about how persecuted they are for their religious beliefs. Blacks would have the priesthood and they would be more homophobic than the non polygamous version. Maybe interracial polygamous marriages would be discouraged. I can see TV commercials with one guy, five wives and lots of kids playing in the background that ends with "We are just like everyone else." (Okay maybe that is a stretch but with reality TV these days, who knows.)

Actually, one could play around with a lot of "what ifs" in regards to polygamy. If it had not been suspended then the number of LDS people from increases in birth rates would have made up for all the people who would not have joined the Church. In fact, since eugenics was the big thing in the 1920s (where do you think Hitler got all his ideas if not for Britain and the USA?) maybe polygamy would have been advocated by those in influential circles in the western world. Maybe even the Sexual Revolution that was started by Wilhelm Reich would have looked to polygamy as a way to challenge the system if millions of people in the USA were members of the LDS faith and hundreds of thousands were in polygamist families.

The church would have also been far more radical as it would never have adopted the Stockholm Syndrome it has towards patriotism to the US government.

Fiannan wrote:Actually, one could play around with a lot of "what ifs" in regards to polygamy. If it had not been suspended then the number of LDS people from increases in birth rates would have made up for all the people who would not have joined the Church. In fact, since eugenics was the big thing in the 1920s (where do you think Hitler got all his ideas if not for Britain and the USA?) maybe polygamy would have been advocated by those in influential circles in the western world. Maybe even the Sexual Revolution that was started by Wilhelm Reich would have looked to polygamy as a way to challenge the system if millions of people in the USA were members of the LDS faith and hundreds of thousands were in polygamist families.

The church would have also been far more radical as it would never have adopted the Stockholm Syndrome it has towards patriotism to the US government.

It is my understanding that birth rates were not higher where polygamy was practiced.

Fiannan wrote:Actually, one could play around with a lot of "what ifs" in regards to polygamy. If it had not been suspended then the number of LDS people from increases in birth rates would have made up for all the people who would not have joined the Church. In fact, since eugenics was the big thing in the 1920s (where do you think Hitler got all his ideas if not for Britain and the USA?)

You are right about Hitler. What people don't realize is just how influential american eugenicists were in Hitlers life. He read a great deal about it and the most famous american eugenicists sent him an autograph copy of their books.

It is all in the book about the books that Hitler read and what books were in his private library.

liz3564 wrote:
I would like to hear comments before voicing my opinion. Frankly, I am not exactly sure myself, and would like to hear from others.

Thanks for contributing!

If a person is LDS and believes in the truth claims of the LDS church then one must believe that polygamy was from god. I think that polygamy was a good testing ground for the faithful and a necessary early LDS experience. But I do believe that with time, it would have been ended because it would have served its purpose. I never thought that polygamy was going to be permanent. I always believed that it was going to be temporary.

Aristotle is probably correct. Or, most of his ideas have high probability of being correct.

Which means my ancestors would have lived in Utah instead of Mexico and I would have more than 4 kids today.

I probably would have just married my second wife at the moment I lost my testimonkey. Damn, that would be awkward...