I am a star

[_Jersey Girl]

I can only speak for my own reaction and have. Dealing with my own yahoolishness is a full time job, I can't imagine making an active choice to be lead by a yahoo.

I'd have to draw the line and move outta there.

I used to hear insinuations over the pulpit...that tone of voice that means the speaker is referring to a literal person they have in mind. I always assumed that was mostly done for rhetorical effect, so everyone would wonder who it was and maybe feel some shame it was them!

But mentioning by name? I've never even heard of that anecdotally.

I've never heard of it either. Let me share with you the other side of the coin and this is the straw that broke the camel's back for me with my own former church.

I assisted a woman who lead a children's ministry, a preschool choir, on Wednesday night when other types of classes are taking place. She not only taught songs and how to sing them, she went the extra mile and taught a lesson and provided a hands on activity. She even purchased a kind of keyboard (can't remember the name of the instrument) off eBay so the children could help make music with their own hands.

She did this for three years.

When her family got a work transfer to another state, she of course needed to give up her class. On the last night that she taught, I saw person after person (including the pastor, his wife, and congregation members who had been there for years--the old guard so to speak) pass by the classroom while walking down the hallway.

Not ONE PERSON, not the pastor, not the wife, not the old guard, and not the parents of the children themselves took a moment to thank her and acknowledge her three year commitment.

When all the children had been dismissed, she and I stood there in the classroom and she had tears rolling down her cheeks from feeling so hurt and unappreciated. All I could say was "I don't believe this!"

The following Wednesday, I chose to stay home. I got a call about 10 minutes prior to class time asking where I was. They *assumed* that I would take her place as choir director. I, in no uncertain terms, told the woman that I was never asked to take her place, I felt no obligation to take her place, that I would never involve myself in the choir ministry ever again and told her exactly WHY, I would never do it.

They let a good and devoted woman, who sacrificed her own time to the benefit of young children walk out the door in tears after three years of service.

They didn't even say goodbye to her!

Silence, in this case, was what sent me toward the exit sign.

[_LDSToronto]

I assumed LDSToronto was not upset about this. Heck if like me, his wife and children have been approached for years with the well intentioned individual catching them in the lobby and expressing their sorrow for the fallen/lost state of their spouse/father but reassuring them how much they love him, and ask the spouse/child to relay the message.

They (spouse/children) are bombarded with this constantly, it’s a well known general consensus and so having it mentioned over the pulpit or from a teacher to a class would only raise amen's, not eyebrows. With our spouses and children so used to it, heck just another Sunday.

After time, the comments do tend to diminish, of course until some talk on missionary work, or re-activation efforts stirs you violently back into play, like a metal pinball hitting a powered bumper.
Ding, ding ding … Ding

Before posting this, I see the LDS is upset … But I'll still post it as it was my experience and I do feel for him and his family.

In our case, my wife actually left the church 4 months before I did, so I fielded all of the sympathy. After I decided to leave, my oldest son wanted to continue to attend. He's old enough to make his own decisions. However, this whole transition has been quick for all of us.

The reason I am upset is because this sends the message to an entire congregation of people I barely know, people I know very well, some of my best friends, and two of my children, that my wife and I are deficient because of the choices we've made.

More so, the person delivering the talk is well-respected and it might be safely assumed that when he says my wife and I have lost our way, he would have formed this conclusion from speaking with me and my wife. Yet, I have not had any interaction with this man since I've stopped going to church, nor have I had a conversation with him regarding my disbelief.

The thing that just puts this over the top is that my kids were put in a very awkward position, that someone in authority made it clear to my kids that my wife had done something wrong. That is just outright unacceptable in my books.

H.

[_Hoops]

I'm sorry LDST and Jersey Girl.

I would like to say I'm never that callous, but I can't. Sometimes people are indescribably insensitive (I oughta know). All I can offer is to let your grace blot out their oafishness.

[_RockSlider]

Silence, in this case, was what sent me toward the exit sign.

Person on phone: "I don't know why, she was just offended with someone"
Supervisor: Well that's really sad, she probably just wanted a reason to go out and sin.

[_Jersey Girl]

I'm sorry LDST and Jersey Girl.

I would like to say I'm never that callous, but I can't. Sometimes people are indescribably insensitive (I oughta know). All I can offer is to let your grace blot out their oafishness.

Hoops there is not enough grace in me to allow for that much "suck it up" in the case that I mentioned.

[_Hoops]

I'm sorry LDST and Jersey Girl.

I would like to say I'm never that callous, but I can't. Sometimes people are indescribably insensitive (I oughta know). All I can offer is to let your grace blot out their oafishness.

Hoops there is not enough grace in me to allow for that much "suck it up" in the case that I mentioned.

That's why I said "let your grace". Easy for me to tell others to suck it up.



(I didn't mean for this particularly church, rather, that all of us are not like what you described all the time)

[_Jersey Girl]

Silence, in this case, was what sent me toward the exit sign.

Person on phone: "I don't know why, she was just offended with someone"
Supervisor: Well that's really sad, she probably just wanted a reason to go out and sin.

The children's music ministry director poked her head in for something or other....never said ONE WORD about it being her last night or thanking her!

What you portrayed above is the exact reason I told the woman just exactly why I wouldn't be coming back much less take over the ministry that no one had the respect to ask me to take over.

[_Jersey Girl]

Okay guys, let's cut the chatter about the post I made. This is LDST's thread, I just wanted to show the other side of the coin which is how people can be made to feel unwelcome and singled out by silence.

[_RockSlider]

LDSToronto,
Yes, I really do empathize with you on this.

As you mention, our situation was a bit different in that it was me, and only me that left.

It was my choice; I could bare the consequences of my choice and knew full well how my ward family would perceive me. What was very very hard for me was that my wife and children also had to bare the consequences of my choice. I did not care how others perceived me, but I always assumed there is this implied scarlet letter on my wife and children as well, that because of me, they were somehow inferior, righteously in the eyes of the ward, because of my actions.

I don't think this "guilt" was just in my head, I believe it was reality (my wife and children being seen as lesser because of it, spoken by name or only sensed by actions)

That's what hurts me.

[_Hoops]

So what are the consequences, ldst?