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Another MDB member (who I trust will make his identity known) sent me a PM this morning to let me know that folks on the MADBoard (MDD) have yet again taken up the subject of the Jaredite Barges.

Of course, as the author of a manuscript currently under peer review and revision for publication in the prestigious Electronic Journal of Jaredite Studies (EJJS), I immediately went to the faithful LDS member site to avail myself of the valuable insights into Jaredite culture that I hoped would be found there.

http://www.mormondialogue.org/topic/57093-mahonris-watercraft/

Given the many valuable insights and additional information and alternative theories that came to light from discussion of the subject manuscript here on MDB (most of which have yet to be incorporated into the manuscript with attribution) I would ask that the Editor of EJJS allow some time for incorporation into the manuscript of any new information that may be gleaned from the MDD thread resource.

As we wait and watch for new insights to emerge over on MDD, I hope that the faithful here will also feel free to follow their fellow faithful on MDD and provide their Jaredite ocean voyage theories and supporting evidence.

I am said member.

As a faculty member, and having several grad students working on the journal, I will put in a good word as there is much more to properly consider. For example, I was unaware that the barges were not intended to flip at all in the rough seas so funny joints (functioning without a gyroscope) would not be needed.

Also, apparently, Mohonri was a great chieftain of some sort, as a barge in this context clearly refers to a luxurious ship of state. Such revelations simply must be included in any future articles.

Since this thread is intended as a discussion of Jaredite culture from the faithful member point of view, Nightlion is specifically invited to post his thesis regarding the Jaredites in Peru theory.

Once his proposition and supporting evidence are laid out, I think that there are a number of folks here who would be willing to consider and discuss it.

What about it Nightlion?

Since this is intended as a discussion from a faithful member perspective, it is likely that points that are brought up over on the MDD Jaredite Barge thread will also be discussed, Tobin, BCSpace, subgenius, Franktalk, ldsfaqs and other faithful members and apologists are also specifically invited to comment as well.

Since I have laid out my position on the Jaredite ocean crossing issue in an earlier thread, I will restrict my comments to responses to others and to issues arising on the MDD thread.

How about it, faithful members? Here is your chance to take the initiative as well as comment on the insights of other faithful members over on MDD.

Does it get any better than that?

Again, the MDD thread is at:

http://www.mormondialogue.org/topic/57093-mahonris-watercraft/

Do they explain why the pictorial representation of the barges on LDS.org bears no resemblance to the text description found in the Book of Ether?

New theories are already emerging on the MDD thread.

zerinus wrote:I believe that the "hole in the bottom" was specifically designed for disposing their waste products. It would have been more than just a "hole". Presumably it would have been constructed with a series of trap doors to enable them to eject their waste products without being flooded.

A series of "trap doors" that would operate in a terrible tempest for removing waste that mostly floats?

I hope we get more of this stuff from MDD. This is very helpful.

DrW wrote:New theories are already emerging on the MDD thread.

zerinus wrote:I believe that the "hole in the bottom" was specifically designed for disposing their waste products. It would have been more than just a "hole". Presumably it would have been constructed with a series of trap doors to enable them to eject their waste products without being flooded.

A series of "trap doors" that would operate in a terrible tempest for removing waste that mostly floats?

I hope we get more of this stuff from MDD. This is very helpful.

It won't be too long before someone voices the opinion that the Jaredite sailors ate the human and animal waste, thereby killing two problematic birds with one apologetic stone...

Better yet, Jaredite centipede.

Over on http://www.mormondialogue.org/topic/57093-mahonris-watercraft/ it just keeps getting better.

guitar wrote:Actually, it may not have required any kind of contraption beyond the "plug" at all--if you keep the top plugged up, and the whole ship is watertight, unplugging the bottom should actually prevent water from seeping in at any real quantity--it's like taking an upside down cup, and pushing it into a sink filled with water--the air has no where to go, so it prevents the water from coming in.

To which Mariner replied:

Mariner wrote:So, by this reasoning, one should be able to drill a hole in the hull of an airtight nuclear submarine and expect the air pressure inside to prevent water from entering the vessel in any real quantity.

Certainly the US Navy, having paid billions of dollars to design and build the leak proof pressure hulls of these vessels, will be shocked to find out that they have wasted their money.

Of course, since Mariner appears to be a critic, I doubt if anyone over there takes him seriously.

DrW wrote:Over on http://www.mormondialogue.org/topic/57093-mahonris-watercraft/ it just keeps getting better.

guitar wrote:Actually, it may not have required any kind of contraption beyond the "plug" at all--if you keep the top plugged up, and the whole ship is watertight, unplugging the bottom should actually prevent water from seeping in at any real quantity--it's like taking an upside down cup, and pushing it into a sink filled with water--the air has no where to go, so it prevents the water from coming in.

To which Mariner replied:

Mariner wrote:So, by this reasoning, one should be able to drill a hole in the hull of an airtight nuclear submarine and expect the air pressure inside to prevent water from entering the vessel in any any real quantity.

Certainly the US Navy, having paid billions of dollars to design and build the leak proof pressure hulls of these vessels will shocked to find out that they have wasted their money.

Of course, since Mariner appears to be a critic, I doubt if anyone over there takes him seriously.

Now they're just left with explaining how they didn't run out of oxygen in this air tight container and why the methane build up didn't cause any notable difficulties...it's a good job apologetics doesn't require joined up and consistent thinking...

BUMP for Nightlion and Tobin.

You both complained that nobody would listen to you regarding the Jaredite barges.

Now we (at least STS and I) are watching the faithful at MDD as they discuss this issue and would love to hear your theories as well.

Come on guys.

Or were you not really serious?