Time for same-sex LDS marriages--SL Tribune

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_Daniel2
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Time for same-sex LDS marriages--SL Tribune

Post by _Daniel2 »

The following article was published in today's Salt Lake Tribune:

Time for same-sex LDS marriages
http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/opinion/53 ... h.html.csp
By Brad Carmack

First Published Apr 04 2012 01:01 am • Last Updated Apr 04 2012 01:01 am

"Hi, my name is Brad Carmack, calling on behalf of Protect Marriage Maine. Will you vote to maintain the traditional definition of marriage as between a man and a woman?"

This was my phone pitch in October of 2009. Calling from Provo, I was a volunteer in the effort to persuade Maine voters to oppose same-sex marriage. The following month the Maine referendum prevailed by 53 percent to 47 percent. Victory!

Now it’s coming up on 2 1/2 years since my anti-same-sex marriage activism and I find myself on the opposite side of the fence. During my last year at Brigham Young University, I risked my diplomas (MPA and JD) by writing and openly distributing a book about same-sex marriage and homosexuality entitled Homosexuality: A Straight BYU Student’s Perspective.

As I wrote I discovered the science behind sexual orientation, the social arguments for and against same-sex marriage, and the heart-wrenching stories of gay Mormons. This experience, along with some soul-searching and prayer, eventually convinced me to support same-sex marriage.

Mormonism is unequivocally pro-family. So is same-sex marriage. This is the strongest reason Mormonism can abide gay marriage. To my surprise, I’ve learned that same-sex couples can and do make wonderful parents.

Homosexual orientation is about more than lust; it’s about companionship, emotional intimacy and romance. Just like heterosexual orientation. The gay couples I know experience the same troubles and joys as my opposite-sex friends. Same-sex couples (and their children) stand to gain from the mutual caretaking, community support, and stabilizing effects of marriage. Risky mixed-orientation marriages (such as a gay man and a straight woman) and lifelong celibacy threaten healthy marriage more than do monogamous same-sex partnerships.

I also discovered that there is room within LDS theology for embracing gay families. Yes, I know the church vigorously opposed same-sex marriage in Hawaii, Alaska and California. Yes, many cite the church’s "Family Proclamation" and the 2010 Church Handbook of Instructions as clear condemnation of all homosexual behavior. However, the church’s law of chastity has always been explicitly tied to legal marriage — in which case a monogamous, legally married LDS same-sex couple in Massachusetts is already abiding the law of chastity.

What about scripture? We have no record of Jesus condemning homosexuality during His ministry. The Book of Mormon, Doctrine and Covenants, and Pearl of Great Price are silent about same-sex relationships. As many scholars have persuasively argued, the five or so Bible verses frequently referenced do not condemn homosexual conduct per se.

The "Family Proclamation" is not doctrine (compare it to both Official Declarations, which were voted on by general church membership), and even if it were, it does not provide an applicable test for discerning one’s spiritual sex (witness intersex persons).

I believe this is the moral issue of my LDS generation. After all, it is my (mostly straight) generation that will become the parents of tomorrow’s gay and lesbian children. My peers and I are fiercely committed to building a world where a robust opportunity for a healthy marriage is not limited to our straight children.

I pray for the day when more Mormons come to see the value of same-sex relationships, and seek to match an institution to the reality of homosexual orientation that will yield the same personal and societal benefits that flow from matching heterosexual marriage to heterosexual orientation.

Jesus taught that the Sabbath was made for man, and not man for the Sabbath (Mark 2:27). Can we make a Sabbath marriage that is made for mankind — gay/lesbian mankind?

As Latter-day Saints, I for one believe that we can. And I hope that we will.

Brad Carmack is an attorney and lives in Phoenix, where he is an active member of the LDS Church.


I firmly believe that people from all religions should be free to dictate and advocate for their own beliefs, and support both Mormons' and non-Mormon's individual abilities to do so, whether attempting to persuade those of other Faiths or amongst their own memberships. While I do not agree with everything in his article, nor his religious convictions, I applaud Mr. Carmack's efforts to positively affect pro-gay attitudes in his own Faith.

Daniel2
"Have compassion for everyone you meet even if they don't want it. What seems conceit, bad manners, or cynicism is always a sign of things no ears have heard, no eyes have seen. You do not know what wars are going on down there where the spirit meets the bone."--Miller Williams
_Buffalo
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Re: Time for same-sex LDS marriages--SL Tribune

Post by _Buffalo »

He's got guts! This is the kind of thing the church will be dealing with from the younger generation. Just as my generation couldn't understand the racism of our parents' generation, the rising generation cannot understand the homophobia of the older generations. The church WILL have to give in, or become totally irrelevant.
Parley P. Pratt wrote:We must lie to support brother Joseph, it is our duty to do so.

B.R. McConkie, © Intellectual Reserve wrote:There are those who say that revealed religion and organic evolution can be harmonized. This is both false and devilish.
_Drifting
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Re: Time for same-sex LDS marriages--SL Tribune

Post by _Drifting »

I think President Newsroom and the Joint Chiefs of Staff in the Strengthening Church Members Committee may well have this chaps name on the agenda of the next Damage Limitation meeting.
“We look to not only the spiritual but also the temporal, and we believe that a person who is impoverished temporally cannot blossom spiritually.”
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"One, two, three...let's go shopping!"
Thomas S Monson - Prophet, Seer, Revelator
_Buffalo
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Re: Time for same-sex LDS marriages--SL Tribune

Post by _Buffalo »

I hope the church responds in typical knee jerk fashion. That would only hasten the lesson they need to learn.
Parley P. Pratt wrote:We must lie to support brother Joseph, it is our duty to do so.

B.R. McConkie, © Intellectual Reserve wrote:There are those who say that revealed religion and organic evolution can be harmonized. This is both false and devilish.
_lostindc
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Re: Time for same-sex LDS marriages--SL Tribune

Post by _lostindc »

I love the verbal and non-verbal responses I receive when I explain to active LDS the Church is only a decade away from accepting practicing LGBTs.

How will Will Shyrivererer, Scott Llyod, and the other non-objectives respond to their bishop wearing a dress?
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_Fiannan
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Re: Time for same-sex LDS marriages--SL Tribune

Post by _Fiannan »

lostindc wrote:I love the verbal and non-verbal responses I receive when I explain to active LDS the Church is only a decade away from accepting practicing LGBTs.

How will Will Shyrivererer, Scott Llyod, and the other non-objectives respond to their bishop wearing a dress?


The sad part about this is that if Pres. Monson were to announce total acceptance of gay marriage in the Church tomorrow the next testimony meeting you would see some of your most ardent critics of homosexuality or gay parenting up behind the stand crying and telling everyone how they sincerely waited for this truly inspired day to come.

Personally I think we may in the future, maybe 15 or 20 years down the road, see gay civil marriages accepted (maybe to head off legal threats from an Obama Supreme Court) but I doubt we will see temple marriages between the same gender allowed.
_lostindc
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Re: Time for same-sex LDS marriages--SL Tribune

Post by _lostindc »

Fiannan wrote:
The sad part about this is that if Pres. Monson were to announce total acceptance of gay marriage in the Church tomorrow the next testimony meeting you would see some of your most ardent critics of homosexuality or gay parenting up behind the stand crying and telling everyone how they sincerely waited for this truly inspired day to come.

Personally I think we may in the future, maybe 15 or 20 years down the road, see gay civil marriages accepted (maybe to head off legal threats from an Obama Supreme Court) but I doubt we will see temple marriages between the same gender allowed.


Likewise, I believe there would be a large population taking the 'fence sitters' angle and as we have seen...this belief will carry on for the foreseeable future.
2019 = #100,000missionariesstrong
_Buffalo
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Re: Time for same-sex LDS marriages--SL Tribune

Post by _Buffalo »

The day when they finally stop persecuting gays is the day that Pahoran leaves the church and the day that Wade and Droopy finally come out of the closet.
Parley P. Pratt wrote:We must lie to support brother Joseph, it is our duty to do so.

B.R. McConkie, © Intellectual Reserve wrote:There are those who say that revealed religion and organic evolution can be harmonized. This is both false and devilish.
_Corpsegrinder
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Re: Time for same-sex LDS marriages--SL Tribune

Post by _Corpsegrinder »

Buffalo wrote:...and the day that Wade and Droopy finally come out of the closet.

I believe it. It's the Eric Cartman syndrome.
_Rambo
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Re: Time for same-sex LDS marriages--SL Tribune

Post by _Rambo »

This is interesting and I am starting to see this attitude amoungst my LDS friends. One of my active LDS friend thinks the church is wrong about same sex marriages and he thinks it will change one day with revelation.

I told him that my family members would question the truthfulness of the church if that happened. He said that they might be lacking a bit on their testimonies.

Whats interesting is that he can't understand my families stance and how they don't see anything changing. Yet they can't understand him. It's like they belong to different churches.

A while ago I was sitting with 4 LDS friends and they were all pro gay marriage. It was really neat to hear how they talked about it. There is going to be change for sure in the next 20 years.
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