DiscussMormonism.com

The Church has been criticized lately by evangelicals for not swallowing the doctrine of the trinity as they do. Some of them have stated that this makes the church, in essence, not Christian. They have claimed that Bible believing Christians accept the doctrine of the trinity.

However, in my opinion, there have been very few, if any, more foolish doctrines associated with Christianity than the doctrine of the trinity. First of all, it has it's roots in the Athanasian Creed, which was written during the time of Atenasius, but no one really knows who wrote it. This document has to be one of the most foolish things ever to come from the mind of man, and it somehow ties together all three beings of the Godhead into "one substance," somewhat like a three in one laundry detergent. It certainly has to push an intelligent mind to great lengths to try to imagine why, for example, Christ would pray to Himself, or land on Himself at His own baptism meanwhile throwing His voice to heaven exclaiming that He is well pleased with Himself, or how part of this substance would know when He would return again, but the other part somehow would not. "For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine." And, they look upon the "first vision" as being strange, however, this is only brought about because of a "great apostasy." What Joseph saw was closer, but no different than what Stephen saw, or what many other Biblical prophets saw, and that was Jesus Christ at the right hand of Heavenly Father! This is the true Biblical and Christian doctrinal teaching that has been restored to the earth again along with so many other things as part of the great "restitution of all things."

gdemetz wrote:The Church has been criticized lately by evangelicals for not swallowing the doctrine of the trinity as they do. Some of them have stated that this makes the church, in essence, not Christian. They have claimed that Bible believing Christians accept the doctrine of the trinity.

However, in my opinion, there have been very few, if any, more foolish doctrines associated with Christianity than the doctrine of the trinity. First of all, it has it's roots in the Athanasian Creed, which was written during the time of Atenasius, but no one really knows who wrote it. This document has to be one of the most foolish things ever to come from the mind of man, and it somehow ties together all three beings of the Godhead into "one substance," somewhat like a three in one laundry detergent. It certainly has to push an intelligent mind to great lengths to try to imagine why, for example, Christ would pray to Himself, or land on Himself at His own baptism meanwhile throwing His voice to heaven exclaiming that He is well pleased with Himself, or how part of this substance would know when He would return again, but the other part somehow would not. "For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine." And, they look upon the "first vision" as being strange, however, this is only brought about because of a "great apostasy." What Joseph saw was closer, but no different than what Stephen saw, or what many other Biblical prophets saw, and that was Jesus Christ at the right hand of Heavenly Father! This is the true Biblical and Christian doctrinal teaching that has been restored to the earth again along with so many other things as part of the great "restitution of all things."

What did Hinckley mean when he stated that Mormons don't worship the same Christ that Christians do and how does that mean Mormons can still be Christian?

While the doctrine of trinity isn't terribly Biblical, neither is the doctrine of a corporeal Father.

If the biggest Mormon faction gets to decide who can be called Mormons, the biggest Christian factions get to decide who can be called Christians.

DarkHelmet wrote:If the biggest Mormon faction gets to decide who can be called Mormons, the biggest Christian factions get to decide who can be called Christians.

Indeed.

gdemetz wrote:However, in my opinion, there have been very few, if any, more foolish doctrines associated with Christianity than the doctrine of the trinity. First of all, it has it's roots in the Athanasian Creed, which was written during the time of Atenasius, but no one really knows who wrote it. This document has to be one of the most foolish things ever to come from the mind of man, and it somehow ties together all three beings of the Godhead into "one substance," somewhat like a three in one laundry detergent. It certainly has to push an intelligent mind to great lengths to try to imagine why, for example, Christ would pray to Himself, or land on Himself at His own baptism meanwhile throwing His voice to heaven exclaiming that He is well pleased with Himself,

Gdemetz, you seem to be thinking one person in three substances as the trinity. You also have the wrong creed. However I am confident you may be Christian without understanding the Trinity.

DarkHelmet wrote:If the biggest Mormon faction gets to decide who can be called Mormons, the biggest Christian factions get to decide who can be called Christians.

I tried to explain this to my MIL and her hubby the other day but failed miserably. Think I was trying to be too diplomatic.

Anyway point was that LDS need to make peace with the fact that as a minority religion (in terms of what it accepts, creeds etc) they do not control the term "christian" and likely never will. So unless they change their views on the Trinity, creeds etc they will likely never change the opinion of most regarding their christian-ness. Calling out the fact that Jesus Christ is in the Church's name ain't gonna do it.


This isn't about getting into the club, it's really about convincing another club to join your club. Which kind of speaks to the question below.


"What did Hinckley mean when he stated that Mormons don't worship the same Christ that Christians do and how does that mean Mormons can still be Christian?"

The trouble is that most Mormons don't try to understand the Trinity. There are not three beings that exist in one substance as if substance were something physical. The Trinity does not posit three physical substances all combined into one physical substance. The term substance is simply a philosophical term describing the fact that Father, Son and Holy Ghost are three separate persons who are the same in their existence. The main point of the Trinity was to confirm that Jesus and the Father have always been exactly the same in their divinity -- it has nothing to do with anything physical. It's not a very hard concept to understand except for the fact that it is hard for finite humans to comprehend an eternal God.

Is there a link to these recent criticisms? I'd like to read them.

What did Hinckley mean when he stated that Mormons don't worship the same Christ that Christians do and how does that mean Mormons can still be Christian?

Christ - Christian, Duh!

Of course our Christianity doesn't look like their traditional or creedal christianity.