DiscussMormonism.com

More and more, I am of the belief that those raised in "the Church" were subjected to brainwashing and behavioral modification from an early age.

Did you ever 'bear your testimony' with someone whispering in your ear what to say next? At what age did that begin? Who was the older person putting these words in your mouth? Did you wonder at the time why?

Did it seem like a charade to you?

Did you wonder if your peers (other children about your age) were saying that they knew? Did you suspect that they did not know? Did you ask any of them how they knew?

Inquiring minds want to know.

I know the church is twoo.

I know my mom and dad luv me.

I know the prophet is twoo.

I know the book of moomon is twoo.

I know the Facismile No. 3 Explanations are twoo too.

In the name of jezzus Christ -- bite me.

Paul O

Who needs the KEP? JSJr gave us the Facsimiles.

TBMs, please explain the Facsimiles? (and please, do so with a straight face).

I dare ya.

I double dog dare ya.

Did it seem like a charade to you?

It's no more a charade than ANY teaching at a young age of what one considers to be true; scientific, religious, or whatever.

That being said, I think most LDS will agree they are also encouraged to develop their own testimony at the appropriate time.

bcspace wrote:

Did it seem like a charade to you?

It's no more a charade than ANY teaching at a young age of what one considers to be true; scientific, religious, or whatever.

That being said, I think most LDS will agree they are also encouraged to develop their own testimony at the appropriate time.

The question is if you were prompted to say things before you'd developed your own testimony of them.

by the way, what is the 'appropriate' time?

bcspace wrote:

Did it seem like a charade to you?

It's no more a charade than ANY teaching at a young age of what one considers to be true; scientific, religious, or whatever.
....

Excuse me? Has anyone on this board ever whispered into their children's ears as they repeated before an admiring audience "I know that the earth goes round the sun. I know that momentum is conserved. I know that nearly all the mass of an atom is concentrated in a very small nucleus ..." and so on?

In any case, facts like that are not so much science in themselves as facts that science has enabled us to discover. The first serious bit of science I tried to explain to my kids was the notion of a 'fair test' - that is, the way one sets about trying to find out whether an idea is true by doing carefully thought out experiments about it. The mental attitude implied by that is the precise opposite of how people drum the 'truths' of their particular religion into the pliant consciousnesses of children too young to resist.

sock puppet wrote:

bcspace wrote:It's no more a charade than ANY teaching at a young age of what one considers to be true; scientific, religious, or whatever.

That being said, I think most LDS will agree they are also encouraged to develop their own testimony at the appropriate time.

The question is if you were prompted to say things before you'd developed your own testimony of them.

by the way, what is the 'appropriate' time?

Didn't Boyd K Packer famously say (to missionaries) something along the lines of, the way to gain a testimony is to bear testimony repeatedly until you believe it?

sock puppet wrote:
by the way, what is the 'appropriate' time?

I haven't seen young children do this in a long time. However, some kids wish to copy their parents and go up to the podium to say their testimony. When this happens, what should a parent do? Parents are constantly socializing their children into a belief pattern. It comes with being a parent: to put various values that the parent wishes the child to have.

Chap wrote: The first serious bit of science I tried to explain to my kids was the notion of a 'fair test' - that is, the way one sets about trying to find out whether an idea is true by doing carefully thought out experiments about it. The mental attitude implied by that is the precise opposite of how people drum the 'truths' of their particular religion into the pliant consciousnesses of children too young to resist.

And of course you the parent get to decide what is fair. So, if your child said that it was fair that he got more than his brother because he is bigger, you would say???? Or if your daughter said that she took her sister's doll because she loves it more??? Would those statements be fair too you??? But if they are fair for your children what should you do??? Nothing?

why me wrote:

Chap wrote: The first serious bit of science I tried to explain to my kids was the notion of a 'fair test' - that is, the way one sets about trying to find out whether an idea is true by doing carefully thought out experiments about it. The mental attitude implied by that is the precise opposite of how people drum the 'truths' of their particular religion into the pliant consciousnesses of children too young to resist.

And of course you the parent get to decide what is fair. So, if your child said that it was fair that he got more than his brother because he is bigger, you would say???? Or if your daughter said that she took her sister's doll because she loves it more??? Would those statements be fair too you??? But if they are fair for your children what should you do??? Nothing?

I saw this post because I looked at the board without logging in (a warning to me to be more careful).

As usual, the whyme chatbot generates text based on a few key-words without signs of any intellectual activity.

The 'fair test' notion as known to science educators is about devising experiments that test, for instance, which of two toy giro cars can go further than another one without stopping. For the test to be 'fair', one has to ensure that the two cars are treated identically - running on the same track, on the same slope, pushed for the same amount of time before being released, and so on. The 'fairness' bit is about being fair to the physical objects that are tested, not to other children, and exploits a notion that children care about a great deal.

It does not spoil the science experience if children disagree about what is fair to the toy cars and what is not - one of the points of the whole thing is to point to the fact that methodological discussions and debates are an integral part of science.

I'll leave whyme on ignore, and be careful to login before seeing the board in future.