December Ensign on tithing

[_Sammy Jankins]

This article is in the latest issue of the Ensign (December 2012)

http://www.LDS.org/ensign/2012/12/sacred-transformations?lang=eng

The Vigils’ bishop, César Orellana, also saw changes in their lives. Soon after their baptism, Amado approached Bishop Orellana and said, “We want to pay tithing, but we don’t know how.”

Bishop Orellana explained that tithing was 10 percent of their increase. Amado was somewhat concerned. At the time, Evelyn had a job, but he did not. “We always come up short,” Amado explained to his bishop, “but we want to pay tithing.”

Bishop Orellana responded, “Brother, the Lord has made many promises.” Together they read scriptures about the blessings that come from faithfully paying tithing, including the Lord’s words through the prophet Malachi: “Bring ye all the tithes into the storehouse, … and prove me now herewith, saith the Lord of hosts, if I will not open you the windows of heaven, and pour you out a blessing, that there shall not be room enough to receive it” (Malachi 3:10).

After reading these scriptures together, Bishop Orellana looked at the new convert and said, “If paying tithing means that you can’t pay for water or electricity, pay tithing. If paying tithing means that you can’t pay your rent, pay tithing. Even if paying tithing means that you don’t have enough money to feed your family, pay tithing. The Lord will not abandon you.”

The next Sunday, Amado approached Bishop Orellana again. This time he didn’t ask any questions. He simply handed his bishop an envelope and said, “Bishop, here is our tithing.”

Reflecting on this experience, Bishop Orellana says, “Ever since then, they have been faithful tithe payers.” The family received some commodities from the bishops’ storehouse during their financial difficulties. Beyond that, the Lord blessed them to be able to care for themselves. Evelyn received a promotion, and Amado found a good job. Evelyn later lost her job, but they continued to pay tithing and to receive spiritual and temporal blessings for their faithfulness. Once Bishop Orellana asked Amado how the family was doing financially. Amado responded, “We’re doing all right. Sometimes we don’t have much to eat, but we have enough. And more than anything, we trust in the Lord.”

After paying tithing for some time, Evelyn and Amado spoke with Bishop Orellana about the blessings they had received. Referring to Malachi 3:10, they said, “We have proven the Lord.” And true to Bishop Orellana’s promise, the Lord never abandoned them.

Although the statements made in this article are comparable to statements that have been made previously on tithing, I thought it was a little worse since the family in question doesn't "have much to eat." It bothers me that some family could be going hungry because of the church.

[_harmony]

The problem with any message about tithing from SLCentral is that it's couched in terms of "you will get no blessings if you don't pay tithing". which is a crock. Tithe paying Mormons make up only an infinitely small percentage of people in the world, and to claim all of God's blessing for them/us alone is just bogus, not to mention incredibly arrogant. Even non-tithe paying Mormons are blessed, and it's really bad manners to say they are not. So are Catholics, Buddhists, atheists, and Muslims. Either all of God's have access to his blessings, or none of them do.

A donation that is given in response to a command is not a donation at all. There are a bucketload of problems associated with the way the LDS church collects donations. This is just one of them.

[_Sammy Jankins]

@Harmony
I agree there are a lot of problems with tithing in general, but I find it somewhat offensive to require it of the most destitute. When the bishop says "Even if paying tithing means that you don’t have enough money to feed your family, pay tithing." I think the church crosses a line from simply being misguided to being immoral.

When reading this article, at first wondered what was the purpose. Surely the church isn't so desperate for money that they need the small contributions from the extremely poor. Then I realized that it was likely meant to motivate the middle class and wealthy to donate more tithing.

[Guest]

A life long TBM friend of mine recently went through a divorce after a 28 year marriage. She and her husband were both faithful tithe payers who followed the letter of the law. Since her divorce she has taken a more skeptical view of the Church, partly because she saw how many of her faithful 'friends' reacted to the divorce and partly because the promises of blessings for faithful devotion didn't always work out. A large reason for the divorce was her family's ongoing problem with money compounded by her husband's inability to secure and keep a job. In the end, besides having to provide most of the monetary support for their large family, she also did most of the child rearing and housework, while the husband faithfully carried all the other roles expected in the Church. He just couldn't hold a job. Everyone liked him, he was good to my friend and the kids, faithfully filled all his Church callings and they always paid their tithing.

The end result was decades of family, Church, and public support. My friend felt like they had lived their entire lives begging people for money, going through bankruptcies and living off of other people largess. She said to me, "I kept waiting for the Lord to bless us for our tithing faithfulness with financial independence and a stable job for my husband and it never happened."

It's stories like these that one never hears in Fast & Testimony meetings.

[_Sammy Jankins]

It's stories like these that one never hears in Fast & Testimony meetings.

The stories we hear in Fast & Testimony meetings are obviously from a self-selected group. You'll never hear the stories from the people who pay tithing and still struggle month to month or from people who had their family members bail them out when they got into financial trouble. When you're only hearing one side of the story it's easy to get the wrong impression.

[_beastie]

Although the statements made in this article are comparable to statements that have been made previously on tithing, I thought it was a little worse since the family in question doesn't "have much to eat." It bothers me that some family could be going hungry because of the church.

This is as irresponsible as telling young marrieds not to delay having children for education. I don't know if that's still their counsel, but it was when I was young.

Also consider that many tithing families may have enough to eat, but not enough to save for retirement, which is more important than ever in this day of disappearing pensions.

The funny thing is that the church wasn't always so hard-nosed with tithing. It was only after the church went through its own financial crisis that the leadership decided that tithing was to be a high priority for everyone, no matter their situation. The days of the Jubilee forgiveness of tithing debt are likely over for good.

[_bcspace]

Although the statements made in this article are comparable to statements that have been made previously on tithing, I thought it was a little worse since the family in question doesn't "have much to eat." It bothers me that some family could be going hungry because of the church

It must bother you greatly as well that Jesus didn't have any bread or fish for the widow who cast two mites into the treasury; everything she had.

[_Doctor CamNC4Me]

Well, I wouldn't trust a god that conspires with Satan to kill a faithful person's children. It seems to me that the Biblical god isn't very consistent with His blessings, frankly.

V/R
Dr. Cam

[_Sammy Jankins]

Although the statements made in this article are comparable to statements that have been made previously on tithing, I thought it was a little worse since the family in question doesn't "have much to eat." It bothers me that some family could be going hungry because of the church

It must bother you greatly as well that Jesus didn't have any bread or fish for the widow who cast two mites into the treasury; everything she had.

I'm not a Bible expert, nor am I a believer. That said reading the few passages on Widows mite, I don't see it as Jesus endorsing what she did. It's more of an acknowledgement that her sacrifice was greater because she had less to give.
Also I don't see Jesus commanding others to do the same.
But if we do interept it to mean that we should donate to God's church over feeding our families I still object to the idea all the same.

[_Doctor CamNC4Me]

Look. Bottom line is why would anyone want to hide their finances?

Herp. Derp.

V/R
Dr. Cam