John Dehlin update

[_Equality]

can I get a few concise examples of why one should be mad at Dehlin? I thought the core issue causing anger is that Dehlin has decided to go back to Church.

Have you read the thread?

[_Kishkumen]

Love is important. Sacrifice, community, service, unselfishness, and social networks are important. Doing good, being honest, true, and benevolent are important. If I could figure out what, specifically, the admonition of Paul is, I'd likely say that that is important, too. But is "the truth" important? Maybe, but it isn't that important.

That's cool.

[_why me]

When I first left the church nearly 15 years ago, I had a missionary zeal to convert others to seeing the world as I do. Now, I don't. If somebody lives a great life believing what they believe, I smile and feel happy for them. I think people are important. Love is important. Sacrifice, community, service, unselfishness, and social networks are important. Doing good, being honest, true, and benevolent are important. If I could figure out what, specifically, the admonition of Paul is, I'd likely say that that is important, too. But is "the truth" important? Maybe, but it isn't that important.

Remember: all I'm offering is the truth. Nothing more.

The church has given you a wonderful foundation to build a life. Your list could have came out of the Ensign.

Exmormons need to be grateful for the lds teachings that are currently in their lives when they choose to live them even when out of the lds church.

[Guest]

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[_Kishkumen]

Hey, I enjoy Matrix as a fun movie. I just don't find it particularly deep.

But, Keanu is also a totally sucky actor.

[_Kishkumen]

Listening to the first part of the podcast, I am realizing that I must have not been on a MoSto wavelength like all the folks who feel let down.

I am not hearing the stuff that is so offensive. It's like the omelette thing. I think to myself, being a parent, "yeah! I would have been squirming if some guy started saying colorful stuff around my kids."

Guess I'm an old fogey.

[_Mayan Elephant]

up yours. whatever. the tone of his post was fine. yours is rather douchey.

Up yours back. Most everything you have written on this thread is douchey.

Now quit whining.

be specific.

[Guest]

Listening to the first part of the podcast, I am realizing that I must have not been on a MoSto wavelength like all the folks who feel let down.

I am not hearing the stuff that is so offensive. It's like the omelette thing. I think to myself, being a parent, "yeah! I would have been squirming if some guy started saying colorful stuff around my kids."

Guess I'm an old fogey.

interesting. i continued to have a dialogue with dehlin long after that breakfast. he invited his wife to join us. he invited his mother in law. he took me into his home and showed me where he produced his podcasts. i said nothing offensive or threatening in front of his kids. he cannot support that assertion. i did a podcast with him after that visit. you have no clue, maybe you are a fogey, or perhaps you are simply just being a jerk.

[Guest]

When I first left the church nearly 15 years ago, I had a missionary zeal to convert others to seeing the world as I do. Now, I don't. If somebody lives a great life believing what they believe, I smile and feel happy for them. I think people are important. Love is important. Sacrifice, community, service, unselfishness, and social networks are important. Doing good, being honest, true, and benevolent are important. If I could figure out what, specifically, the admonition of Paul is, I'd likely say that that is important, too. But is "the truth" important? Maybe, but it isn't that important.

Remember: all I'm offering is the truth. Nothing more.

The church has given you a wonderful foundation to build a life. Your list could have came out of the Ensign.

Exmormons need to be grateful for the lds teachings that are currently in their lives when they choose to live them even when out of the lds church.

that's a nice thought, why me, but it's not true.

sure, my Mormon parents did teach me some good things. but parents of some other faith or of no faith would have been equally likely to teach me the importance of people, love, community, and service. these are not novel Mormon concepts. you do realize that, right? they're nearly universal human values.

and then you also have to factor in all the insane things my Mormon parents taught me (informed by their faith) that were impediments to my moral development. for example, they taught me that gay people are evil and dangerous. they taught me that i should only date and marry someone of my own race. they taught me that obedience in itself was a virtue. they taught me that submitting to authority was more important than learning and reasoning. they taught me that pre-marital sex was almost as bad as murder (!). they taught me that no act can be wrong if god commands it.

if the milkshake is 10% crap, it's a crap shake, why me, and i won't be thanking the church for it.

[Guest]

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