LDSToronto wrote:While I think ordination of women is a fantastic idea, I also feel that this step is too early.
Simply put, while the change is long overdue, you can't go from wearing pants to praying in conference to ordination. I think there need to be a few intermediate steps between 'pray in GC' and 'ordain women'.
H.
What steps?
(Nevo, Jan 23) And the Melchizedek Priesthood may not have been restored until the summer of 1830, several months after the organization of the Church.
LDSToronto wrote:While I think ordination of women is a fantastic idea, I also feel that this step is too early.
Simply put, while the change is long overdue, you can't go from wearing pants to praying in conference to ordination. I think there need to be a few intermediate steps between 'pray in GC' and 'ordain women'.
H.
What steps?
I don't know, harmony, I haven't thought much about the steps needed. Clearly, 'Wear Pants' and "Let Women Pray" are steps in the right direction: get rid of the cultural baggage before tackling the doctrinal.
"Ordain Women" seems less like a step and more like a leap - kind of like "give an inch, take a mile". I'd love to see women ordained, I wonder, though, if there are a few more things that have to happen first.
H.
"Others cannot endure their own littleness unless they can translate it into meaningfulness on the largest possible level." ~ Ernest Becker "Whether you think of it as heavenly or as earthly, if you love life immortality is no consolation for death." ~ Simone de Beauvoir
I don't know, harmony, I haven't thought much about the steps needed. Clearly, 'Wear Pants' and "Let Women Pray" are steps in the right direction: get rid of the cultural baggage before tackling the doctrinal.
"Ordain Women" seems less like a step and more like a leap - kind of like "give an inch, take a mile". I'd love to see women ordained, I wonder, though, if there are a few more things that have to happen first.
H.
Oh, I thought you were going to write something along the lines of: have funerals for virtually all of the current Brethren.
(Nevo, Jan 23) And the Melchizedek Priesthood may not have been restored until the summer of 1830, several months after the organization of the Church.
1. Mission leadership roles for women such as making them district leaders, zone leaders and assistants. 2. Allowing women to participate in blessing circles. 3. Allowing mothers to give their children blessings. 4. Allowing women to give blessings to the sick. 5. An increased presence at the pulpit at both sacrament meeting & conference talks.
"Any over-ritualized religion since the dawn of time can make its priests say yes, we know, it is rotten, and hard luck, but just do as we say, keep at the ritual, stick it out, give us your money and you'll end up with the angels in heaven for evermore."
1. Mission leadership roles for women such as making them district leaders, zone leaders and assistants. 2. Allowing women to participate in blessing circles. 3. Allowing mothers to give their children blessings. 4. Allowing women to give blessings to the sick. 5. An increased presence at the pulpit at both sacrament meeting & conference talks.
Since 1-4 are presently priesthood related, the basic prohibition still has to change first.
(Nevo, Jan 23) And the Melchizedek Priesthood may not have been restored until the summer of 1830, several months after the organization of the Church.
Since 1-4 are presently priesthood related, the basic prohibition still has to change first.
I disagree that 1,3 & 4 require holding the priesthood. 2 would require a change to the requirements to stand in the circle which would not necessarily have to be priesthood related. Why would a female missionary have to hold the priesthood to be made a district leader over other female missionaries? Women gave blessings in the past without holding the priesthood.
Edit to add. It has been a long while since I attended. Doesn't the prayer circle in the temple include both women and men?
"Any over-ritualized religion since the dawn of time can make its priests say yes, we know, it is rotten, and hard luck, but just do as we say, keep at the ritual, stick it out, give us your money and you'll end up with the angels in heaven for evermore."
The only step required is for the Prophet to receive a 'revelation'. Overnight black people went from unable to able to: attend the Temple; hold the Priesthood (and all the activities that this facilitates). Literally, the change happened overnight and everyone in the Church accepted it and got on with it from that day forward (apart from a couple of individual racists here and there).
No steps in between. Simple.
That said, with the Book of Mormon, we are not dealing with a civilization with no written record. What we are dealing with is a written record with no civilization. (Runtu, Feb 2015)
1. Mission leadership roles for women such as making them district leaders, zone leaders and assistants. 2. Allowing women to participate in blessing circles. 3. Allowing mothers to give their children blessings. 4. Allowing women to give blessings to the sick. 5. An increased presence at the pulpit at both sacrament meeting & conference talks.
1 - works, because I think, today, women who serve later-life missions work as assistants in the office. Though I thought zone leaders & district leaders needed priesthood authority to conduct interviews?
2 - I am almost certain I've seen non-member men in blessing circles
3,4 - happened before, can happen again
5 - easy
I'd add:
6. Allow women to hold the callings of clerk, executive secretary, Sunday School President, Mission Leader
"Others cannot endure their own littleness unless they can translate it into meaningfulness on the largest possible level." ~ Ernest Becker "Whether you think of it as heavenly or as earthly, if you love life immortality is no consolation for death." ~ Simone de Beauvoir