Another Discernment Fail: BYU Law Hires Sociopath

[_Bazooka]

Interesting. Sociopathy and narcissism seem to be accurate descriptions of some of the more prominent anti Mormon posters here. For example, sociopaths never answer facts, they always attack the messenger.

Please can you give us a couple of examples of prominent anti Mormon posters here "never" answering facts?
Please can you give us a couple of examples of prominent anti Mormon posters here "always" attacking the messenger?

A HUGE one that you see here among anti Mormons is the inventing of outrageous lies about their experiences. "They wildly exaggerate things to the point of absurdity, but when they describe it to you in a storytelling format, for some reason it sounds believable at the time."

This is usually referred to as "Fast & Testimony Meeting"...

[_Bob Loblaw]

So, it is your contention then, that if the Church is true, the BYU administration would be, by definition, mediated by the direct revelations of the Holy Ghost in its hiring decisions? How about what brand of toilet pater to use in the law faculty bathrooms? How about determinations of grades?

Given that getting a job teaching at BYU requires an interview with a GA, it's not much of a stretch to wonder why said GA wasn't "warned of God" about this woman.

[_Bob Loblaw]

Interesting. Sociopathy and narcissism seem to be accurate descriptions of some of the more prominent anti Mormon posters here. For example, sociopaths never answer facts, they always attack the messenger.

You do realize that's exactly what you are doing right here. Self-awareness is not your forté, is it?

A HUGE one that you see here among anti Mormons is the inventing of outrageous lies about their experiences. "They wildly exaggerate things to the point of absurdity, but when they describe it to you in a storytelling format, for some reason it sounds believable at the time."

Thank God we have discerning folks like you to tell us what is real and what isn't.

[_Ceeboo]

Hey BC!

Interesting. Sociopathy and narcissism seem to be accurate descriptions of some of the more prominent anti Mormon posters here. For example, sociopaths never answer facts, they always attack the messenger.

Quite an odd and chuckle producing post!

A HUGE one that you see here among anti Mormons is the inventing of outrageous lies about their experiences. "They wildly exaggerate things to the point of absurdity, but when they describe it to you in a storytelling format, for some reason it sounds believable at the time."

Strange with additional quiet laughter to myself!

Peace,
Ceeboo

[_Tator]

Interesting. Sociopathy and narcissism seem to be accurate descriptions of some of the more prominent anti Mormon posters here. For example, sociopaths never answer facts, they always attack the messenger.

You do realize that's exactly what you are doing right here. Self-awareness is not your forté, is it?

A HUGE one that you see here among anti Mormons is the inventing of outrageous lies about their experiences. "They wildly exaggerate things to the point of absurdity, but when they describe it to you in a storytelling format, for some reason it sounds believable at the time."

Thank God we have discerning folks like you to tell us what is real and what isn't.

bc methinks you got caught with your pants down.

[_ZelphtheGreat]

No, but I have seen the inside of a North Vietnamese Prison.

BYU has the nasty habit of teaching "The Lord" inspires their choice of faculty. A hard thing to justify when one looks at faculty members closely.

Or apostate members who once taught at BYU but couldn't handle the standards and disciplines of the restored gospel.

Moved to CA to teach at another school with higher pay, nicer location to live and much better opportunities to pursue my personal work. Still don't drink, smoke or any of the 'bad stuff' Mormons are so worried about. Your asinine assumptions tell much about you. None of it positive.

It is lds such as yourself and bc space that make me glad I now live where Mormons are almost as scarce as Lamanites.

[_Bob Loblaw]

Moved to CA to teach at another school with higher pay, nicer location to live and much better opportunities to pursue my personal work. Still don't drink, smoke or any of the 'bad stuff' Mormons are so worried about. Your asinine assumptions tell much about you. None of it positive.

It is lds such as yourself and bc space that make me glad I now live where Mormons are almost as scarce as Lamanites.

Funny how Droopy automatically believes people leave BYU only because they can't handle the standards. What does he make of those who stay who don't live the standards, like the guy who would approve a master's thesis only if the applicant slept with him?

[_dryfly]

No, but I have seen the inside of a North Vietnamese Prison.

BYU has the nasty habit of teaching "The Lord" inspires their choice of faculty. A hard thing to justify when one looks at faculty members closely.

Or apostate members who once taught at BYU but couldn't handle the standards and disciplines of the restored gospel.

How many members of the BYU faculty are members of the National Academy of Sciences?

[_Mayan Elephant]

No, I'm saying that neither the Holy Ghost, nor any being in Heaven, as Joseph said, will do anything for humans on earth that they are quite capable of doing for themselves. Hiring a person who later turns out to be a less that qualified employee is one of the vicissitudes of mortality and really more a banality then grist for the Holy Ghost's ministrations, as is scratchy toilet paper. Not that in some cases, the Spirit would assist in hiring or other important decisions, but only that He does not indiscriminately reveal what should or should not be done in each and every aspect of life just because one is LDS or has the Gift of the Holy Ghost.

And now, on to more serious discussions, such as masturbation, licked cupcakes, gay marriage, and nonexistence.

good to see that you are still a damned idiot, droopy.

i think the holy ghost was absent for the hiring of at least 15 other current church employees as well.

[_Equality]

So, it is your contention then, that if the Church is true, the BYU administration would be, by definition, mediated by the direct revelations of the Holy Ghost in its hiring decisions? How about what brand of toilet pater to use in the law faculty bathrooms? How about determinations of grades?

Given that getting a job teaching at BYU requires an interview with a GA, it's not much of a stretch to wonder why said GA wasn't "warned of God" about this woman.

Additionally, to get hired at the BYU, potential employees must obtain an "ecclesiastical clearance." That Ms. Lund, who has such loathing for the LDS church (if her comments in the PT article and her book are to be taken at face value), could obtain such an ecclesiastical clearance from her priesthood leader means that either the priesthood leader discerned her true feelings about the church and gave her the clearance anyway, or he failed to receive any spiritual witness of her duplicity; i.e. discernment FAIL. The church claims BYU is different from secular institutions. It claims to be led by "prophets, seers, and revelators." These same "prophets, seers, and revelators" dominate the membership of the BYU Board of Trustees.

. . .the Board of Trustees has power to fill all vacancies in the University and final say in the hiring, promoting and dismissing of University faculty . . .

https://sites.lib.byu.edu/byuorg/index.php/Brigham_Young_University._Board_of_Trustees

I should not be, but continue to be, surprised at the things some of our believing Mormon friends at this board will debate, seemingly for the sake of argument. The idea that Mormons view BYU as more than a mere secular institution, a place where the Spirit of the Lord inspires the people who teach, administer, and learn there I thought was an uncontroversial proposition. But Droopy and bcspace have bizarrely taken up arms against the notion and, in doing so, find themselves once again out of the mainstream of Mormon belief and in opposition to the prophets they are supposed to sustain. From Ernest Wilkinson, citing Brigham Young, as published in the official magazine of the LDS church and as found on its official website:

The foundation for the educational philosophy of Brigham Young University was established nearly a century ago when, in 1875, President Brigham Young called Dr. Karl G. Maeser to go to Provo to assume the principalship of the newly organized Brigham Young Academy.

Brother Maeser, who was a convert German schoolmaster and disciplined in the precision of his homeland, asked President Young for his instructions.

“I have only these,” President Young said. “You should not teach even the alphabet or the multiplication tables without the Spirit of God. That is all. God bless you. Good-bye.”

The charge was so simple that it almost puzzled Dr. Maeser, but he could have found no firmer foundation upon which to build the school. Beginning with twenty-nine students, he became the spiritual architect of what now has become the world-important Brigham Young University, which, with twenty-five thousand students, is the largest private university in the United States. And that spirit, so firmly structured at that time—giving the students spiritual training as well as the finest academic education possible—has continued as paramount policy at Brigham Young University down to the present.

. . .

The success of any institution of higher education and the value of its contribution to society as a whole rest primarily upon its faculty. At Brigham Young University, faculty members are chosen, as in other great universities, for academic scholarship and competence, degrees and distinctions, achievement and recognition in research and creative endeavors; but a difference is that they are chosen at BYU primarily for worth as outstanding teachers and also for a spirit of service, loyalty, and adherence to the principles of the gospel.

. . .

My comments would not be complete without my testimony as to the divinity of this institution.

. . .

And I believe that this university is a part of that church and has the same divine mission. It was established under the direction of Brigham Young, the president of the Church, and is now directed by a board of trustees presided over by President Joseph Fielding Smith.

You can read the whole speech HERE.

This idea that the Mormontologists advance--that we critics set up straw men when we hold the church to its own standards and hold church leaders and members accountable for the ideas they themselves have espoused for years--is absurd. The lengths they will go to avoid uncomfortable truths ceases not to amaze me.