Bcspace, a question about the flood.

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_SteelHead
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Re: Bcspace, a question about the flood.

Post by _SteelHead »

Is JST official?

From a thread 2 years ago
SteelHead wrote:JST Genesis 6 vs Genesis 6 KJV

Chapter 6 (Moses 8:13–30)
1 And Noah and his sons hearkened unto the Lord, and gave heed, and they were called the sons of God. And when these men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born unto them,
OT1 And it came to pass that Noah and his sons hearkened unto the Lord, and gave heed, and they were called the sons of God. And when these men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born unto them,
2 That the sons of men saw that their daughters were fair; they took them wives even as they chose. And the Lord said unto Noah: The daughters of thy sons have sold themselves; for behold mine anger is kindled against the sons of men, for they will not hearken to my voice. And it came to pass that Noah prophesied, and taught the things of God, even as it was in the beginning.
3 And the Lord said unto Noah: My Spirit shall not always strive with man, for he shall know that all flesh shall die; yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years; and if men do not repent, I will send in the floods upon them.
4 And in those days there were giants on the earth, and they sought Noah to take away his life; but the Lord was with Noah, and the power of the Lord was upon him. And the Lord ordained Noah after his own order, and commanded him that he should go forth and declare his Gospel unto the children of men, even as it was given unto Enoch. And it came to pass that Noah called upon the children of men that they should repent; but they hearkened not unto his words; And also, after that they had heard him, they came up before him, saying: Behold, we are the sons of God; have we not taken unto ourselves daughters of men? And are we not eating and drinking, and marrying and given in marriage? And our wives bare unto us children, and the same are mighty men, which are like unto them of old, men of great renown. And they hearkened not unto the words of Noah.
OT1 And in those days there were giants on the earth, and they sought Noah to take away his life; but the Lord was with Noah, and the power of the Lord was upon him. And the Lord ordained Noah after his own order, and commanded him that he should go forth and declare his Gospel unto the children of men, even as it was given unto Enoch. And it came to pass that Noah called upon men that they should repent; but they hearkened not unto his words; And also, after that they had heard him, they came up before him, saying: Behold, we are the sons of God; have we not taken unto ourselves the daughters of men? And are we not eating and drinking, and marrying and given in marriage? And our wives bare unto us children, and the same are mighty men, which are like unto them of old, men of great renown. And they hearkened not unto the words of Noah.
5 And God saw that the wickedness of man had become great in the earth; and every man was lifted up in the imagination of the thoughts of his heart, being only evil continually. And it came to pass that Noah continued his preaching unto the people, saying: Hearken, and give heed unto my words; Believe and repent of your sins and be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ, the Son of God, even as our fathers did, and ye shall receive the Holy Ghost, that ye may have all things made manifest; and if ye do not this, the floods will come in upon you; nevertheless they hearkened not.
OT1 And God saw that the wickedness of man had become great in the earth; and every man was lifted up in the imagination of the thoughts of his heart, being only evil continually. And it came to pass that Noah continued his preaching unto the people, saying: Hearken, and give heed unto my words; Believe and repent of your sins and be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ, the Son of God, even as our fathers did, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost, that ye may have all things made manifest; and if ye do not do this, the floods will come in upon you; nevertheless they hearkened not.
6 And it repented Noah, and his heart was pained that the Lord made man on the earth, and it grieved him at the heart.
OT1 And it repented Noah, and his heart was pained that the Lord had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.
7 And the Lord said: I will destroy man whom I have created, from the face of the earth, both men and beasts, and the creeping things, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth Noah that I have created them, and that I have made them; and he hath called upon me; for they have sought his life.
OT1 And the Lord said: I will destroy man whom I have created, from the face of the earth, both man and beast, and the creeping things, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth Noah that I have created them, and that I have made them; and he hath called upon me; and they have sought his life.
8 But Noah found grace in the eyes of the LORD.
9 For Noah was a just man, and perfect in his generation; and he walked with God,
OT1 And Noah was a just man, and perfect in his generations; and Noah walked with God,
10 And also his three sons, Shem, Ham, Japheth.
OT1 And also his three sons, Shem, Ham, and Japheth.
11 But the earth was corrupt before God, it was filled with violence.
12 And God looked upon the earth, and, behold, it was corrupt; for all flesh had corrupted its way upon the earth.
13 And God said unto Noah, The end of all flesh is come before me; for the earth is filled with violence; and, behold, I will destroy all flesh from off the earth.
14 Make thee therefore an ark of gopher wood; rooms shalt thou make in the ark, and thou shalt pitch it within and without with pitch.
OT1 Make thee an ark of gopher wood; rooms shall thou make in the ark, and shalt pitch it within and without with pitch.
15 And the length of the ark thou shalt make three hundred cubits, the breadth of it fifty cubits, and the height of it thirty cubits.
16 And windows shalt thou make to the ark, and in a cubit shalt thou finish it above; and the door of the ark shalt thou set in the side thereof; lower, second, and third chambers shalt thou make in it.
17 And, behold, I, even I, will bring in a flood of water upon the earth, to destroy all flesh, wherein is the breath of life, from under heaven; every thing that liveth on the earth shall die.
OT1 And, behold, I, even I, do bring in a flood of waters upon the earth, to destroy all flesh, wherein shall be the breath of life, from under heaven every thing that liveth on the earth shall die.
18 But with thee will I establish my covenant; even as I have sworn unto thy father Enoch, that a remnant16 of thy posterity should come all nations. And thou shalt come into the ark, thou, and thy sons, and thy wife, and thy sons' wives with thee.
OT1 But with thee will I establish my covenant; even as I have sworn unto thy father Enoch that a remnant of thy posterity should be preserved among all nations which shall come and thou shalt come into the ark, thou, and thy sons, and thy wife, and thy sons' wives with thee.
19 And of every living thing of all flesh, two of every kind shalt thou bring into the ark, to keep alive with thee; they shall be male and female.
20 Of fowls after their kind, and of cattle after their kind, of every creeping thing of the earth after his kind, two of every kind shalt thou take into the ark to keep alive.
21 And take thou unto thee of all food that is eaten, and thou shalt gather fruit of every kind unto thee in the ark; and it shall be for food for thee, and for them.
22 Thus did Noah; according to all that God commanded him.
OT1 Thus did Noah; according to all that God commanded him, even so. Amen.


Notice the multiple additions of the word ALL.
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_Bazooka
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Re: Bcspace, a question about the flood.

Post by _Bazooka »

Water Dog wrote:Let me guess, this is this where you show me some quote from some leader, or lesson manual, that describes the flood as a global event. Good for them, that's not an official position...


Water Dog wrote:It has official positions defined in the scriptures (so far as they are translated and interpreted correctly). I would say the articles of faith also constitute an official position.

That seems to cover pretty well everything.


The scriptures describe the flood as a Global event so is that the official position or not?
Because you are saying both that it is and also that it isn't.
That said, with the Book of Mormon, we are not dealing with a civilization with no written record. What we are dealing with is a written record with no civilization. (Runtu, Feb 2015)
_SteelHead
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Re: Bcspace, a question about the flood.

Post by _SteelHead »

Is the POGP?

Moses 8
28 The earth was corrupt before God, and it was filled with violence.

29 And God looked upon the earth, and, behold, it was corrupt, for all flesh had corrupted its away upon the earth.

30 And God said unto Noah: The end of all flesh is come before me, for the earth is filled with violence, and behold I will destroy all flesh from off the earth.
It is better to be a warrior in a garden, than a gardener at war.

Some of us, on the other hand, actually prefer a religion that includes some type of correlation with reality.
~Bill Hamblin
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Re: Bcspace, a question about the flood.

Post by _Res Ipsa »

SteelHead wrote:Is the POGP?

Moses 8
28 The earth was corrupt before God, and it was filled with violence.

29 And God looked upon the earth, and, behold, it was corrupt, for all flesh had corrupted its away upon the earth.

30 And God said unto Noah: The end of all flesh is come before me, for the earth is filled with violence, and behold I will destroy all flesh from off the earth.


Oh Snap!
​“The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists.”

― Hannah Arendt, The Origins of Totalitarianism, 1951
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Re: Bcspace, a question about the flood.

Post by _Res Ipsa »

Water Dog wrote:
Notice the small 'e' in earth? The translation of the word "earth" in Moses is understood to have the same original Hebrew meaning as it does in the Old Testament. earth != Earth

finite geographic area != Planet Earth


In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.


Genesis 1:1

So, was the creation local or global?
​“The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists.”

― Hannah Arendt, The Origins of Totalitarianism, 1951
_SteelHead
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Re: Bcspace, a question about the flood.

Post by _SteelHead »

Water Dog wrote:
Notice the small 'e' in earth? The translation of the word "earth" in Moses is understood to have the same original Hebrew meaning as it does in the Old Testament. earth != Earth

finite geographic area != Planet Earth


So when God says the "end of all flesh"..... it doesn't mean all. Thank you Bill Clinton!!!!!!

Image
It is better to be a warrior in a garden, than a gardener at war.

Some of us, on the other hand, actually prefer a religion that includes some type of correlation with reality.
~Bill Hamblin
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Re: Bcspace, a question about the flood.

Post by _schreech »

you know how i know you're a troll?

Water Dog wrote:
Notice the small 'e' in earth? The translation of the word "earth" in Moses is understood to have the same original Hebrew meaning as it does in the Old Testament. earth != Earth

finite geographic area != Planet Earth


Image
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_SteelHead
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Re: Bcspace, a question about the flood.

Post by _SteelHead »

Well he could argue back that god only created Palestine (little e earth) and the rest of the planet (big E earth) sprung into existence from the forehead of Zeus......
It is better to be a warrior in a garden, than a gardener at war.

Some of us, on the other hand, actually prefer a religion that includes some type of correlation with reality.
~Bill Hamblin
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Re: Bcspace, a question about the flood.

Post by _cwald »

SteelHead wrote:Sweet.....

How many variations of what constitutes doctrine do we have now between the various defenders on this board?


Yeah, no crap.

Apologetics at its best.

OMG. No wonder the church is spinning in circles and bleeding out.
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_mentalgymnast
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Re: Bcspace, a question about the flood.

Post by _mentalgymnast »

SteelHead wrote:Ok WD, before we veer off into more doctrines of WD mingled with hot air, what is the official position of the LDS church in regard to the nature of the flood of Noah?

A: Global

B: Local


Depends on who you ask. James E. Talmage, David O. McKay, and John Widstoe would have their POV. Joseph Fielding Smith and Bruce R. McConkie would have theirs. This translates into "we don't have all the information", for the definitive answer.

None of these guys went inactive or apostate worrying about it though.

Regards,
MG
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