Plural Marriage in Kirtland and Nauvoo Essay Up!

[_CameronMO]

Thought people would be excited.

Just as I thought. No changes.

That's good!

[_suniluni2]

Question: Is it not true that ... if she refuses her consent her husband is exempt from the law which requires her consent.

President Smith: Yes; he is exempt from the law which requires her consent. She is commanded to consent, but if she does not, then he is exempt from the requirement.

Question: Then he is at liberty to proceed without her consent, under the law. In other words, her consent amounts to nothing?

President Smith: It amounts to nothing but her consent.

This quote kind of makes President Smith seem like a assclown.

Totally. I try to use every opportunity I get. It has to give any TBM pause as to why the prophet of the Lord was so...douchey.

[_Uther]

There is a saying I remember hearing a few times in church: "Satan's most effective lies are half-truths or lies accompanied by truth".

I think Satan would be proud of this essay, if it were'New Testament for the fact that he is a fictional character invented by man to explain the darker sides of reality.

My suggestion for a more truthful essay text would be something like:

"We, the corporation of the president of the LDS church, apologize profusely for the lies made by and broken hearts caused by, the charismatic founder of our religion. While attempting to justify his appetite for the other sex, Joseph Smith jr manipulated his wife and a large group of vulnerable women and men, and even invented theology to support his actions. Rivers of tears and pain followed, and only after intense external pressure, and a difficult internal processes, we as a church were able to rid ourselves of this evil. We acknowledge that we as a church have been embarrased of Joseph Smith jr's conduct, and have tried to keep this information from reaching daylight. We have punished individual members that have discovered this information earlier on in an attempt to protect "the flock". We will no longer try to cover this up, lie about it, or hire clowns to invent excuses for Joseph Smith jr's actions. We acknowledge that Joseph Smith jr married minors, other mens wives, lied and manipulated people that trusted him, and that he probably had sex with most of his "wives" even though he did not document or publish evidence of the sexual acts. As a small token of repentance we have freed up 4 billion USD that was previously intended to build and decorate temples, and will instead donate this money to charities that help abused and battered women".

Kind regards
Uther

[_grindael]

A complete whitewash...

The essays seemed to have adobted Brian Hales worldview rather than Todd Compton's...ergo...Polygamy was Super Awsome !!! All in favor bow your heads and say Yes

I'm betting Hales wrote it for them. But apparently it will take some kind of special faith and knowledge to understand it...

“It appears that plural marriage is gospel meat that can only be understood by those who have sufficiently prepared themselves in faith and knowledge.” –Brian Hales, “Common Explanations for Joseph Smith’s Polygamy,” online here http://josephsmithspolygamy.org/theolog ... lanations/

Anyone who claims that a person cannot understand something without some kind of “faith” and special “knowledge”, has already shown that their conclusions cannot be reached by any reasonable method used by the public at large (like simply reading and evaluating the evidence).

For example, I think that one can easily understand (without special faith and knowledge) why stories began circulating a decade after Smith died that he only practiced polygamy because he was threatened by an angel with a sword who vowed to run him through if he didn't start marrying more women—and this in direct contradiction of all that Smith ever taught about free agency. I think people get that. It makes Smith look more reluctant (whatever good that does) and therefore more prophet-like in the eyes of his followers (and faithful apologists).

Too bad there is no evidence that this ever happened. It also turns the Mormon God into the Mormon Satan, who wanted to force everyone to do what they were told so they could become “gods”.

It doesn't take special “faith and knowledge” to understand when there isn't any evidence. Yet that doesn't stop some from repeating folk tales as if they were reality and denigrating those that don’t agree with their wacky conclusions.

Bravo!

[_ludwigm]

"We, the corporation of the president of the LDS church, apologize profusely for the lies made by and broken hearts caused by, the charismatic founder of our religion. While attempting to justify his appetite for the other sex, Joseph Smith jr manipulated his wife and a large group of vulnerable women and men, and even invented theology to support his actions. Rivers of tears and pain followed, and only after intense external pressure, and a difficult internal processes, we as a church were able to rid ourselves of this evil. We acknowledge that we as a church have been embarrased of Joseph Smith jr's conduct, and have tried to keep this information from reaching daylight. We have punished individual members that have discovered this information earlier on in an attempt to protect "the flock". We will no longer try to cover this up, lie about it, or hire clowns to invent excuses for Joseph Smith jr's actions. We acknowledge that Joseph Smith jr married minors, other mens wives, lied and manipulated people that trusted him, and that he probably had sex with most of his "wives" even though he did not document or publish evidence of the sexual acts. As a small token of repentance we have freed up 4 billion USD that was previously intended to build and decorate temples, and will instead donate this money to charities that help abused and battered women".

You passed a sentence upon yourself --- if one of the authorities would read this.

"We will no longer try to cover this up, lie about it"
This would mean we have tried to cover this up, we have lied about it...

Álom, álom, édes álom, álomkép...
Dream, dream, sweet dream, dream image... (3:09 youtube)

operetta by Kálmán Imre --- if you know the word and/or the author...

The lyrics: (sorry, google translated...)

Dream a dream

Dancing with happiness, my soul flame,
No one had not been such a good mood
Oh sweet, this moment has been waiting a long time ago,
There are no two people are happier than we

Sweet dream dream dream dream image
I dream that one else will we yet
Angels look down on us if sugdossák [they are whispering]
Well the earth is heavenly bliss

I'm afraid, I'm afraid this is just a dream not to be,
Reality can not be much good ground
That's nice for God only gives good mood
We need to thank him very much back

Sweet dream dream dream dream image
I dream that one else will we yet
Angels look down on us if sugdossák [they are whispering]
Well the earth is heavenly bliss

A rosy sugar coated text, as usual operettas and usual Mormon stories.

[_Maureen]

Church members no longer practice plural marriage.54 Consistent with Joseph Smith’s teachings, the Church permits a man whose wife has died to be sealed to another woman when he remarries. Moreover, members are permitted to perform ordinances on behalf of deceased men and women who married more than once on earth, sealing them to all of the spouses to whom they were legally married.

Does the Church permit a woman whose husband has died to be sealed to another man when she remarries? If not, why not?

The LDS church for quite a few years now has a policy where a deceased woman can be sealed to all the men she had been married to, who are also deceased. So these proxy sealings would have to be done by family members, possibly grandchildren. But if LDS members do not know this policy exists, it's not likely that many deceased women are being sealed to multiple husbands.

M.

[_Bazooka]

Yes, but a living man can be sealed to multiple women as long as only one of them is alive.
A living woman can only be sealed to one man and if he dies she cannot be sealed to another.

This is a discriminatory practice.

[_Mayan Elephant]

This is a discriminatory practice.

it is not discriminatory if it includes imaginary ordinances with dead people. that is just weirdness.

[_Bazooka]

What now is the difference between Joseph Smiths plural marriages and those of Warren Jeffs?

[_SteelHead]

160 years?